hello guys, mazda noob here. got a 2003 B3000 from a family member a few months ago. It had rough idle when I got it and a check engine light. changed plugs, wires and a new coil and since then its been running decent with no check engine. We were out running around yesterday and come back from a walk and the truck wouldn't start. Not a battery issue, battery is turning it strong. it was more like a no spark thing. a passer-by stopped to lend a hand and he was able to tell there was spark from the coil when I tried to start it. after about 20 minutes of chatting and talking though things, we decided that I would have it towed to a friends shop this morning. The nice couple brought us home and after about 30 minutes we went back to where we left the truck and it started 1st start. upon startup, I noticed a distinct knock...but after about 10 seconds, the knock stopped. the truck has plenty of oil because I keep a good check on that type of stuff. I do remember during the several times I tried the ignition during the no start period, that there was no movement of the oil pressure needle. I drove the truck to work this morning and home with no issues. started first try and no more knocking. suggestions??? thanks

 

I would have the the computer checked for codes in memory, auto parts stores can do that for free, don't buy anything based on any codes, just post them here, if any.

An engine needs 3 things to start, besides starter motor working.
1. spark, at the right time
2. fuel, in the correct mix with air
3. compression, to heat the fuel enough for a spark to ignite it

Compression is a "you have enough or you don't", engine wouldn't start again if this were the problem, so it is off the table.

Spark, easy to test for spark but not spark timing, but lets assume you have spark at the right time.

That leaves fuel.
When you turn on the key the computer will turn on the Fuel Pump for 2 seconds, listen for this so you know what it sounds like, it isn't quiet, you will here the hum of the fuel pump in the gas tank if you listen for it.
Turn key on and off at much as you want, it won't hurt anything, until you recognize what the fuel pump sounds like.

Next time there is a no start, listen for the fuel pump, it is not to unusual for fuel pump to become intermittent on start up, once it is running it would be fine, just when this electric motor is trying to start is when a problem can occur.
There is also a fuel pump relay that may become intermittent.


Oil pressure often won't show at starter motor RPMs, hard to say if that is a symptom of anything.

"Knocking" can be a few things, obviously a bearing issue is one of those things, but that is something that doesn't "get better", once bearing has worn enough to knock it will knock, it would knock quieter with more oil but it would still knock.

Could you have heard a Lean fuel knock, pinging is the other term, lower fuel pressure at start up will cause lean fuel knocking until fuel pressure has built back up, taking a few seconds, and that would fit with fuel pump/power issue.

 

I read somewhere (maybe you Ron ???) that if there is no oil pressure the computer would keep the engine from starting.
Which leads me to the cam shaft position sensor.
Suppose the roll pin is about to shear of and now it's binding and working again.
Such a condition would explain the gauge not showing oil pressure.
I know cheap CSPS's have smaller roll pins compared to the Ford one's.


It might be worth it to pull the synchronizer out have it inspected.
If stops turning how long does it take the PCM to throw up a code for it ?

 

thanks for the replies guys. totally new to Fords, so I am learning as I go. the oil pressure thing makes sense to me and I remember not seeing the needle NOT flickering when trying to start it Monday. Could it possibly be the oil pressure sending unit? I have an inexpensive code reader, I can see if it shows anything. I haven't seen a check engine light in a few months. I will report back in a little bit

 

no codes what so ever

 

A common problem with the oil sender is a bad engine ground and/or a bad connection on the sender itself.
The oil pressure gauge always goes to the middle no matter what the oil pressure is.
Ford changed it to that function when the gauge was showing next to no oil pressure at idle.
People were complaining of very little oil pressure at idle, so Ford just turned it into a "dummy" gauge.

 

I had a feeling it was nothing accurate, more or less just a visual

 

well, its been 3 days and I haven't had anymore issues. although, it hasn't been a lot of startups, they have been without a hitch. i will do some looking this weekend to see if i can find any issues

 

I would still like to see you check the synchronizer.
You don't have to take it out or even disconnect the sensor.
There will be two small bolts holding in the plastic sensor.
Remove those and the sensor simply lifts off.
Inside there will be a "tooth" like piece of steel that rotates in front of the sensor.
Gently wriggle this back and fourth and up and down.
There should be very little play in it.
You should not be able to rotate it either.
The gear that drives the "tooth" also drives your oil pump.

 

would this synchronizer cause the truck to stumble and miss under hard acceleration? I was towing a trailer full of furniture about a month ago and noticed when heading uphill at about 3500 rpm, the truck would miss and shudder.

 

Unlikely.
I would think a lack of fuel.
You've already eliminated the problem with wires, plugs and coil pack.

Lack of fuel under hard acceleration would give an engine code _ eg. misfire, too lean.

Did you change your fuel filter ?
How's the air cleaner and how clean is the MAF sensor ?
The connection on the MAF sensor should also be cleaned.

But if it's not throwing up any codes, it's hard to say.

 

no codes. new fuel filter, MAF sensor has been cleaned. I guess I really cant say that I cleaned the connections, I will do that this afternoon. air filter is good and clean

 

update. truck wouldn't start again today, same as originally. I could not hear the fuel pump, which leads me to believe that is my issue.

 

ordered the fuel pump from rockauto. gonna try sliding the bed back method instead of dropping the tank. anyone done this, please feel free to chime in

 

anyone had any dealings with the fuel inertia switch?

 

the inertia switch was tripped....button in the out position. getting fuel on the fuel rail. don't know what kind of pressure, but there is fuel there. a little more info. since my original problem, the truck has been fine. got in it to come home from work yesterday and the truck would not start....same symptoms as before. hopped a ride with a buddy and went back by the work place 5 hours later last night to try it, and it fired right up. drove it to and from work today with no issues and now it wont start. I found the inertia switch and it was in the "tripped" position, even after pressing it...it still wont start. check engine light is on but my generic code reader doesn't show up anything. ready for a nap, anyone got any suggestions?

 

Inertia switch doesn't always "reset", once they are tripped they are meant to be replaced, the button allows temporary use, if vehicle can be driven after an accident.

Inertia switch is not a circuit breaker(like a fuse), it is a deceleration or momentum switch.
You could send 24 volts thru it and it wouldn't "trip".

If vehicle stops suddenly, accident, or rolls over, THEN the inertia switch will "trip".
Once it trips it can not be fully reset, it can be made to work using reset button but it will trip again, and my not be reset-able

 

so when I back the truck into the driveway today, it was running. I shut it off and the curiosity got the best of me as to where the switch was. so I looked to see where it was. Once I found it, It was in the tripped position and so I pressed it...thinking that the switch could be faulty and needed reset. I pressed the switch and looked online to see if there was any certain way to reset it. the first procedure I came across stated to hold the button for 15 seconds, cycle the ignition 3 times to the on position and start it on the 4th try. the truck did start to some extent. The best way to describe was that it was running outta fuel. After that, I have had no success in getting it to start. so are you saying the switch cannot be reset and I should purchase a new one? also, why did I find the switch in the "tripped"postion in the first place?

 

Yes, replace the switch, or put a jumper wire on it for temporary use.

The 2 connectors on the switch pass 12volts to the fuel pump, just 12v in and 12v out, so easy to install jumper wire to remove inertia switch as the possible problem.

If you don't have a history on this vehicle then there is a good chance it was in an accident and repaired, inertia switch was never replaced.

Or it is just a defective inertia switch

 

placed a jumper wire in the connector and it still will not start

 

Then do the 50/50 test.

But first, do you hear the fuel pump start when you turn on the key?
It isn't quiet
It should run for 2 seconds each time you turn on the key

50/50
spray gas, starting fluid or carb cleaner into intake and try to start engine
If it starts and dies then it's a fuel problem
If it doesn't start then it is a spark problem
50/50

 

honestly, I have never been able to hear the fuel pump. my buddy has an S-10 and you can certainly hear his, but not this one. I have a new fuel pump ordered that should be delivered today, that's the weekend project. I would just hate to go through the trouble and it not be the pump.

 

Turn the radio down, you can hear the fuel pump for sure :)

If in doubt open gas cap and listen there while someone turns key on and then off and then on and then...........ect.....
Or put hand on bottom of the gas tank, you will feel it vibrate

 

i will disregard the "turn the radio down" comment, but i do appreciate your suggestions. I have the fuel pump being delivered today, hopefully it will make a whole lot of noise and solve this issue

 

Hey, the radio comment is valid :)
Same as asking if there is gas in the tank when someone has a No Start problem, have to ask, lol.

My wife called me the other day to say say she was locked out of her car, I needed to drive over and bring her the other set of keys.
I said "Did you locked the keys in the car?" she said "no, the Unlock button on the FOB wouldn't work, I think it's battery is dead, its been funny lately"
"I said did you try the key in the door?"
Long pause............."oh, right"
Some times you have to ask the hard questions...........

But in fairness to my wife I don't think anyone with power door locks and Fobs even think about the key slot in the door now.