First Dyno sheet of 4.0 underdrive pulley - Page 2 - Ranger-Forums - The Ultimate Ford Ranger Resource


4.0L OHV & SOHC V6 Tech General discussion of 4.0L OHV and SOHC V6 Ford Ranger engines.

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  #26  
Old 08-25-2005
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I don't mean to knock you product but does it really need the harm balencer ?
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  #27  
Old 08-25-2005
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Interesting product, Those are actually pretty good gains for an UD pulley. Nice work.

Coming from the world of Mazda cars I have read about failures of aux engine components when a UD pulley was installed. Mostly oil pump failures. Any issues with failure of other components due to UD pulleys on these engines?

And I'll restate a question that I saw earlier in this thread but wasn't answered, what would expected gains be from: headers, UD pulley, Intake, Catback exhaust on the 4.0 SOHC engine (I realize once all that is on there using some sort of tuning chip could really max the gains out, but I want a ballpark. :D )
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  #28  
Old 08-25-2005
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Ranger1, It is not even an option from my point of view. If you spent $$$$$$$ to balance and blueprint the motor, it probably wouldn't need, but then noone will produce it like this because of the same reason. The engine needs it. Other makes such as the 3.0 pulley has the balancer as a separate part from the factory. The 3.0 pulley bolts onto the balancer. This is what makes them significantly cheaper in price. The 4.0 from the factory has the balancer built into the pulley.

There are other pulleys such as saturn s-series, maybe neons?, where people have marketed and sold a non balancer pulley to replace a balancer pulley. They may be working very well in the marketplace, but I cannot endorse it. I want the piece of mind. 12HP is a great 12HP if you have the piece of mind with the product.
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  #29  
Old 08-25-2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrodhotrod

And I'll restate a question that I saw earlier in this thread but wasn't answered, what would expected gains be from: headers, UD pulley, Intake, Catback exhaust on the 4.0 SOHC engine (I realize once all that is on there using some sort of tuning chip could really max the gains out, but I want a ballpark. :D )
Sorry about that. Bottomline, testing was done on a '05 Mustang, all stock. This will be the extent of testing from the manufacturer. The rest will be up to us.

The nice thing about the underdrive pulley is that it does not "ride" on another mods coattails, so I would expect that you would get similar results over your baseline regardless of other mods.

You can take a header and will probably get the advertised HP and you can get an exhaust and probably get the advertised HP. You cannot get an exhaust and a header and add the two results. Same would apply with an intake and a bored throttle body. These related mods start diminishig the effects because one partially does what another is meant to do.

The pulley does it's own thing- gaining back the parasitic loss from the driveline.
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  #30  
Old 08-25-2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrodhotrod
Coming from the world of Mazda cars I have read about failures of aux engine components when a UD pulley was installed. Mostly oil pump failures. Any issues with failure of other components due to UD pulleys on these engines?
Someone would have to help me here. Is the oil pump externally driven on the Mazda cars? What about the 4.0 trucks?
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  #31  
Old 08-25-2005
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I'll have to go research it a bit, but I believe on the Miata (where most of the oil pump failures came from, it is.) I'll get back to you.
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  #32  
Old 08-25-2005
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Found the info on the underdrive pulleys in Mazda motors, mostly Miata engines.

"This issue[pump failure], specific to the Mazda 1.6/1.8L engines, involves the flex of the crankshaft and the lower half of the engine due to the additional stress of a forced induction system (such as a turbo or supercharger). The additional stress produced by forced induction causes flexing of both the block and the crankshaft between the front main bearing and the oil pump. This can also contribute to oil pump failure. Early Miatas were notorious for having crankshaft problems and later models suffered from problems as power is increased significantly."

I also found varying reports of issues with the FS-DE 2.0L (Protege) but it appears that most problems stem from forced induction, so if you are keeping it N/A unless you have seen any issues on these problems doesn't seem to be an issue. I'll keep it in mind for when I finally get the okay to start modifying the engine in our truck from the boss (my wife, he he).
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  #33  
Old 08-25-2005
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I have been thinking about it $300 sounds good enough for the benifits, when are they going on sale ?
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  #34  
Old 08-25-2005
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Found this while looking as well:

http://www.dinancars.com/whitepapersFile.asp?ID=5

Good read on what it does, how it works and issues to think about.

My conclusion.

This UDP doesn't remove the harmonic balancer (GOOD) and the displacement in this motor is 4.0L (big) also (GOOD) and if you keep it N/A then it's safe and a great power mod.

It's on my list for when I get to finally start work in the motor in this thing.
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  #35  
Old 08-25-2005
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I have an e-mail into them today to get a best guesstimate on when they would be available. i post when they respond. About 3 months ago they told me in 4 months. It's one of those things that are ready when they are ready. They want it to be tried, trued, and tested.

jrodhotrod, that is a good link. It falls in line with my statement previously. Thanks.
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  #36  
Old 08-26-2005
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I was informend today that they should be available sometime in November. Good timing for someones Christmas want list.
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  #37  
Old 08-26-2005
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Well, they have issues with forced induction...what about my nitrous? I have been running it without any problems for a while now. Just don't want to introduce a weak link into the engine.

I will do some more research and see what I can turn up. I could see the benefits of this. Also, the oil pump in our engines are driven by a shaft.
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  #38  
Old 08-27-2005
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15 ponies at the wheels from a pulley. Intresting. I use a 190amp alt. right now, Rayjay found a good place to get them. I'm going to stay away from Underdriven setups for a while and I have a LOT of electrical draw ( 50 amps alone from dual fans ) .

D.
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  #39  
Old 08-27-2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SONICEDGE03
Well, they have issues with forced induction...what about my nitrous? I have been running it without any problems for a while now. Just don't want to introduce a weak link into the engine.

I will do some more research and see what I can turn up. I could see the benefits of this. Also, the oil pump in our engines are driven by a shaft.
Think of this. Your Noids require about 10 amps a piece. If your available current draw decreases, what happens if only 1 solonoid on a wet setup hits? Too much gas or too much o2. Take your pick, either spells disaster.

Thats another reason why I'm staying away. If it were a WHOLE set of pullies that reduced the mass on all the items ( waterpump, ac, all of it.. ) I might consider it.
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  #40  
Old 08-27-2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D.
Think of this. Your Noids require about 10 amps a piece. If your available current draw decreases, what happens if only 1 solonoid on a wet setup hits? Too much gas or too much o2. Take your pick, either spells disaster.
.
My brother has a '93 transam that runs 11.2's in the 1/4 mile with nitrous. It has nitrous nozzles, e-fan, and electric water pump. IT HAS NO ALTERNATOR. It is charged between runs. If you go to a track you will see dozens of examples that are the same.
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  #41  
Old 08-27-2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by graniteguy
My brother has a '93 transam that runs 11.2's in the 1/4 mile with nitrous. It has nitrous nozzles, e-fan, and electric water pump. IT HAS NO ALTERNATOR. It is charged between runs. If you go to a track you will see dozens of examples that are the same.
Thats great, AT A TRACK. These are daily driven vehicals. You going to stop and charge your vehical at every light or stop sign? Where are these ' Altenatorless ' cars on the road? Think ' practical ' and ' daily driver '

D.
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  #42  
Old 08-27-2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D.
Thats great, AT A TRACK. These are daily driven vehicals. You going to stop and charge your vehical at every light or stop sign? Where are these ' Altenatorless ' cars on the road? Think ' practical ' and ' daily driver '

D.
Let me finish the point I was making.

The alternator is going to be underdriven by 20% or so. At 2,200 RPM it will spin like it is at 1,760. At 3,000 rpm it will spin like it is at 2400 RPM. At 4,000 rpm it is gonna spin like it is at 3,200 rpm. There is no problem and you will get a full charge.

The problem "might" be when you idle at 750 and it spins like it is at 600. If a Trans Am can blast through the 1/4 mile with no alternator and extra electronic stuff for nitrous, e-fan, and electric water pump I would think there is no risk of being stranded or the engine shutting off by idling for a minute or two at a stoplight. I consider it a non-issue. There are so many underdrives out there that are being used with great success. Past history dictates it will work for 99% of the users. The first few installs should testify to it on the 4.0. This is not a new product, just a new product for us.

The great thing is we (4.0 owners) have been waiting patiently to see new products as a result of the 4.0 in the '05 Mustang. Here is one of them and I am excited about this and the possbility of others.
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  #43  
Old 08-27-2005
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The only time that I hit the spray, I am at wide open throttle, so electrical draw isn't going to be an issue.

Wayne, keep me updated on the progress of this. It is sounding better and better the more I am looking at it.
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  #44  
Old 08-27-2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SONICEDGE03
The only time that I hit the spray, I am at wide open throttle, so electrical draw isn't going to be an issue.

Wayne, keep me updated on the progress of this. It is sounding better and better the more I am looking at it.
What kind of track times have you got with the nitrous?
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  #45  
Old 08-27-2005
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Don't know, I haven't ever had the truck on the track :)

It is only a 75 shot, so it doesn't have quite the effect that people associate with nitrous, but I know that it is there and it does kick me up from 105ish to 120 in a hurry!
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  #46  
Old 08-27-2005
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I would suspect 3/4 - 1 second improvement in the 1/4. That is not shabbly at all.
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  #47  
Old 08-27-2005
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Now that I am closer to some tracks, I will be taking it out more. The closest track to me when I was in WI, was like 3 hours or so away. Here there are 2 to choose from lol
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  #48  
Old 09-04-2005
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Last edited by Fx4wannabe01; 09-04-2005 at 03:08 AM.
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  #49  
Old 09-04-2005
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Does this help low end ? I heard it can kill low end people, just want more go for when im playing in the dirt :)
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  #50  
Old 09-04-2005
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Originally Posted by Nate97Ranger
Does this help low end ? I heard it can kill low end people, just want more go for when im playing in the dirt :)
No it does not kill low end.
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