4x4 open rear = Glorified 2wd.... - Ranger-Forums - The Ultimate Ford Ranger Resource


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  #1  
Old 02-13-2006
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4x4 open rear = Glorified 2wd....

True or false, a 4x4 with an open rear end is like a glorified 2wd. Id like to eventually get a locker if I keep my truck however dad is dead set against it. the one thing, I wish my truck had, over 4 doors is the locker. I dunno, seems to me like you have a good chance of getting stuck with a open rear, which is one of the major reasons i have not really gone anywhere remotely exciting.... do you find this logic to be right or wrong?
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Old 02-13-2006
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False...an open FRONT diff. is semi glorified 2wd. In effect an open diff lets the power go to the wheel with least traction(right guys?). so 4wd with open diff has 2 tires with no traction spinning fast and 2 tires with semitraction spinning slow...i think. Someone give him a better explanation than this. I think i confused anyone reading this...
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Old 02-13-2006
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Yes you have more of a chance of getting stuck with open diffs. if you have an open diff the wheel with no tractions spins and the other just sits still. a locker is really handy.
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Old 02-13-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by texasbullseye89
False...an open FRONT diff. is semi glorified 2wd. In effect an open diff lets the power go to the wheel with least traction(right guys?). so 4wd with open diff has 2 tires with no traction spinning fast and 2 tires with semitraction spinning slow...i think. Someone give him a better explanation than this. I think i confused anyone reading this...
you both are wrong. a 4wd with open rear causes the power and torque to be transfer to 1 wheel. this isn't as good as a locker because a locker places power to both wheels evenly. a 4wd isnt a glorified 2wd because the extra traction that the front axle gives is great because that is were most of the weight of the truck, over the front axle.
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Old 02-13-2006
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It doesn't neccessarily send ALL the power to one wheel. That is the most common misconception with an open diff. People think each end only spins one wheel all the time. The power only ends up on one wheel or the other totally when there is an extreme disprotionate lack of traction.
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Old 02-13-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lifted97ranger
you both are wrong. a 4wd with open rear causes the power and torque to be transfer to 1 wheel. this isn't as good as a locker because a locker places power to both wheels evenly. a 4wd isnt a glorified 2wd because the extra traction that the front axle gives is great because that is were most of the weight of the truck, over the front axle.

thanks man...i'm glad someone straightened that mess up....

i don't really understand why people wanna compare 2wd's to 4wd's...there is no comparison. they are two totally different vehicles.

Lockers are great. the thing about lockers is this:

with open diffs, you will only have one wheel spinning. this more than likely means that you are going to slide also, unless you are on a completely flat surface with no grade in either direction with the steering wheel centered. Once you begin to slide with the open differential, the wheel that isn't spinning as quickly, is going to aid in slowing down the slide.

with a locker, as with a posi-trac (limited slip) once you start to slide you don't have that other wheel to add drag and help slow you down.

don't get me wrong, i'm not saying lockers or posi's aren't good because they are. They're great, but they have their downfalls, especially for daily drivers....


just my .02
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Old 02-13-2006
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A 4x4 with open diffs is better in almost all off-road situations than a 2WD, either open or with a limited slip. A locker is better in difficult off-road terrain but not as good overall on pavement. A locker can also be a handful when driving on snow or ice.

Under the right conditions, lockers can put double the torque through your 28-spline axle shafts compared to an open or L/S diff - something to think about.
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Old 02-13-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lifted97ranger
you both are wrong. a 4wd with open rear causes the power and torque to be transfer to 1 wheel.
That is wrong. It sends power equal to all 4 wheels. The wheel on each axle that has the least traction/friction will get all of the wheel speed while the higher friction tire may sit still or barely turn at all. So 2 wheels spin with open/open. The power goes to one wheel per axle, 2 axles, so power to 2 wheels in 4wd.
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Old 02-13-2006
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Another thing to consider.. Pull upto a 8" curb with 2wd.. your front tires arent going over it even with a locker(without momentum anyway). With 4wd the front tires actually
pull it up and over the curb. Lockers are bad unless you are hardcore offroading
or drag racing. Which is why the selectable lockers are gaining in popularity...
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  #10  
Old 02-13-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 034x4
That is wrong. It sends power equal to all 4 wheels. The wheel on each axle that has the least traction/friction will get all of the wheel speed while the higher friction tire may sit still or barely turn at all. So 2 wheels spin with open/open. The power goes to one wheel per axle, 2 axles, so power to 2 wheels in 4wd.

i think he was saying the same thing you were man...1 wheel per drive set i believe is what he was going for
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  #11  
Old 02-13-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rand
Lockers are bad unless you are hardcore offroading
or drag racing.

not so, I have been running a lock-right in my 7.5 for just over 40K miles now and it is absolutely WONDERFUL to have on the street. I no longer sit spinning a tire and going nowhere trying to get into traffic with the damp roads or sand or nasty weather. it just pulls. it has also made the rear end 100 times more predictable, with the open rear it would swing out on me at random times with no predictability, with the locker it acts exactly the same 100% of the time, has the same traits and does the same things all the time. I know when its gonan slide out, i can predict how its going to feel and what its going to take to make it go out. it has made driving in the snow with a 2wd much easier (as long as you know how to handle the vehicle and how to drive comfortably sideways) if not THE best thing ever done to my truck, pretty close to it.
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  #12  
Old 02-13-2006
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im locked front and rear... i absolutely love in offroad and in snow.. drives almost like stock on the pavement.. minus the 1 wheel peels it had when it was open
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  #13  
Old 02-13-2006
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What kind of lockers do you have front and back? Where did you get them? Where could I get them? How much of an investment is it? Did you do it yourself, or pay a shop to do the install?
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Old 02-14-2006
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There have been enough explanations about the differences between 2WD and 4WD.....
As for driving with a locker, limited slip or selectable is a matter of preference...
Selectables such as ECTED, ARB, OX Locker etc.... are just what the name implies... You can turn them on and off as needed and during the time that it is OFF... you dont know they are there !!!
Lockers are engaged ALL of the time (fulltime)... and can be a bit squirelly (word?) IF you are not use to the way they react in mud, ice and snow.... Otherwise they are GREAT since they double your traction with BOTH tires turning with equal power....
Limited slips are a compromise for use when daily driving, but also deliver GREAT traction when needed without some of the quirks that fulltime lockers have.
Having run a Detroit TruTrac limited slip in the front and a Detroit Locker in the rear of my 98 Jeep Cherokee for 6 years while ROCKCRAWLING, mountain trails and some high desert trails... the TruTrac l/s when operated properly will engage almost as good as a locker... No parts to wear out and delivers outstanding performance.
Presently have a Detroit TruTrac in the rear of the Ranger and the traction it delivers is outstanding !!!!

OR 4x4
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Old 02-14-2006
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Do tight circles on pavement with a locker...then let me know how great it is to have a full time locker on pavement. When going around turns, the inside wheel turns slower than the outside wheel, with a locker, this can't happen.

This thread has actually gotten to the point of retarded.

Everybody here is stating their opinions, as fact. I know what I know, and I believe 2 of you, and Bob is one....
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  #16  
Old 02-14-2006
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Why is your dad dead set against it ? Personally if you are not a hard core off-roader you honestly don't need a locker. I off-road a lot 6-15 times a year and I don't need a locker. Honestly I would talk your dad into letting you put a limited slip in.

IMO a LS is the best thing you can have unless you do hard core rock crawling or some kind of hardcore off-roading or drag racing. I have never gotten stuck where I thought if i had a locker I would not have gotten stuck. IMO a LS is the best to have in rainy road conditions(maybe that will help you sell the idea to your dad)
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  #17  
Old 02-14-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lifted97ranger
you both are wrong. a 4wd with open rear causes the power and torque to be transfer to 1 wheel.
Not w/ a part-time 4WD system like our Rangers have. Because we have no center differential power is distributed entirely equally between front and rear axles. The front axle and rear axle must turn at the exact same speed. If you have open differentials on both axles, then at the very least you would end up with 2-wheels receiving torque. You would never end up with just 1 unless you also had an open differential in the t-case.

Having driven a 2WD truck with an open rear-diff, I'd take 4WD any day of the week.. except when it came time to pay for it.
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  #18  
Old 02-14-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chucks05EDGE
Do tight circles on pavement with a locker...then let me know how great it is to have a full time locker on pavement. When going around turns, the inside wheel turns slower than the outside wheel, with a locker, this can't happen.
Chuck,

I thoroughly agree about the locker on pavement.....
My tires BARK at me on occasion when turning on asphault, but when making a turn around a corner.... you learn how not to apply gas into the turn....
The Detroit Locker that is in my Jeep has GREAT on highway and around town road manners... Guess it must be the synthetic lube I am using.... or maybe I have adapted to driving with a locker for over 10 years...
NOTE.... Would never have a full time locker in the front.... Making turns would be constant fight......, but I know people that do it.... This is where a selectable EXCELLS.....

OR 4x4
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  #19  
Old 02-14-2006
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Supergildo has a front lunchbox style locker and says it does pretty well on pavement. but alot has to do with how you apply the go pedal.

he said the most trouble he has had when he gradualy changes lanes like passing and merging on the highway.
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  #20  
Old 02-14-2006
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so are there any selectable lockers for a 7.5"?? I've been searching on the net and I couldn't find any...
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  #21  
Old 02-14-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rolla_guy72
so are there any selectable lockers for a 7.5"?? I've been searching on the net and I couldn't find any...
i dont think so... all the ones i have seen are for the 8.8
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  #22  
Old 02-14-2006
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haha..this is one of those "close...yet so very very far away" comparisons...if it can even be called a comparison. I have a locked RWD truck. there have been "stucks" where the truck could have pulled through only if there was a front differential under there (open or not). So comparing the rear of my truck to an open 4x4 - I have the advantage offroad. But comparing the front axle...um, no question - I don't have a front diff. That's why there's no comparison :)
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  #23  
Old 02-14-2006
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Did some searching around thru the major manufacturers of locking differentials.... There is nothing available other than the Ford TracLoc limited slip.
There may not be enough call for a traction device or they may consider the 7.5" not strong enough to support a l/s or locker....

OR 4x4
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  #24  
Old 02-14-2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OffRoad 4x4
Did some searching around thru the major manufacturers of locking differentials.... There is nothing available other than the Ford TracLoc limited slip.
There may not be enough call for a traction device or they may consider the 7.5" not strong enough to support a l/s or locker....

OR 4x4
you must not search very well, heres the part number for the powertrax lock-right for the 7.5 (the locker i have in my axle) 1830

detroit full locker part number on 4wheelparts DET162C-57A

detroit trutrac L/S part number on 4wheelparts DET912A316

there is plenty of things for the 7.5, the yukon 28-spline axle shafts for the ranger work as well. the 28-spline axle shafts are the same in the 7.5 as the ones in the 8.8. there are so many 7.5s out there it would be rediculous not to have any products avalable for them, so dont start bashing the 7.5s dependability because they can be put through hell and back and not have any issues.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chucks05EDGE
Do tight circles on pavement with a locker...then let me know how great it is to have a full time locker on pavement. When going around turns, the inside wheel turns slower than the outside wheel, with a locker, this can't happen.

This thread has actually gotten to the point of retarded.

Everybody here is stating their opinions, as fact. I know what I know, and I believe 2 of you, and Bob is one....
and i have a lock-right locker in my 7.5 and its been there for over 40K miles so don't tell me i'm giving my opinion here, I am giving fact of having driven one on the street for over 40K miles with one in my truck, and its a 5-speed so it makes it act up even worse. if you dont believe me on that either than go drive both for a long time and let me know what you think. I am giving advice based on actually HAVING a locker in my truck.
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  #25  
Old 02-14-2006
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i have a lock-right in the front and a no-slip in the rear.. the only time you notice it on turns is when your pushin the skinny pedal.. yes it does take a lil bit fo learning when driving in the snow, but i also find that cruising sideways is fun and the truck is 200% more predictable in the snow and rain.. IE i know it will slide out vs when i was open it MIGHT slide out when i least expect it too.

i dont notice the front locker at all during pavement driving. in the snow i have just noticed that a lil bit of torque steer is transmitted into the wheel..

i also do ALL of the work to my truck myself, including gears, lockers, lift, ect
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