Synthetic Oil Change Intervals
#26
11-29-2007
#27
11-29-2007
Originally Posted by IN2 FX4
I use Valvoline synthetic with an additional micron by-pass oil filter and use Motorcraft oil filters. I change the Motorcraft oil filter every 5,000 miles; the oil every 20,000 miles and the micron filter every 25,000 miles.
This extended oil change scedule is based experience I had with my 89 Ranger. I change the oil in it every 25,000 miles and had the oil analyzed. After 20,000 miles the viscosity of the oil started to increase but everything else was perfect.
I drove that 89 Ranger almost 200,000 miles fromt the day I bought it new. The engine ran better at amost 200,000 miles than it did new. It would still use no more than 1 qt of oil in 5,000 miles when I sold it to a co-worker. He is still driving it with no problems with well over 200,000 miles on it.
Don't tell me oil needs to be changed every 3,000 miles. If you want to do it that often, it is certainly up to you but it is not necessary.
Without the micron filter I would probably change oil at around 5,000 mile intervals.
This extended oil change scedule is based experience I had with my 89 Ranger. I change the oil in it every 25,000 miles and had the oil analyzed. After 20,000 miles the viscosity of the oil started to increase but everything else was perfect.
I drove that 89 Ranger almost 200,000 miles fromt the day I bought it new. The engine ran better at amost 200,000 miles than it did new. It would still use no more than 1 qt of oil in 5,000 miles when I sold it to a co-worker. He is still driving it with no problems with well over 200,000 miles on it.
Don't tell me oil needs to be changed every 3,000 miles. If you want to do it that often, it is certainly up to you but it is not necessary.
Without the micron filter I would probably change oil at around 5,000 mile intervals.
BTW, engines that take 1qt of oil every 5k miles are not what I consider "running good". That is burning oil. Thats called blow-by (I think thats the term used, don't quote me on that...)
#28
11-29-2007
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Originally Posted by jrpro130
Maybe you missed the part that my oil change is about $12. A top end or bottom end rebuild for that matter can cost upwards of $2k.
You HAVE to change your oil at some time...so lets just say this... $12/oil change...
166.66 oil changes is an engine rebuild. Thats $2000
At lets say 3000 miles an oil change that is 499,980 miles...I know my truck won't make it to that...
So how is it costing more than a top end rebuild? I'm not understanding that part? I have 82k on my truck, I bought it with 36k, so I've drove 46k miles, at 3k mile intervals that is 15.33 oil changes. At $12 a pop...thats $184 dollars in oil changes.
Now lets just say that you don't get oil for cost...it's about 25 an oil change with filter. Now it would be $383.25 so far that I've spent in oil changes. If I were to stretch that out to the $2000 mark of a top end rebuild (that 2k is just a number to use, top end rebuilds in my area are costly, mechs. know they can rape you, so they usually do) I can get 80 oil changes for $2000. So that is 3k mile intervals, that is 240,000 miles of oil changes...I doubt my engine will make it to that either, but it's good to try!
Now lets go with the "saving money aspect". You say you change oil at 7.5k miles...I have drove 46k miles on my truck.
Thats 6.13 oil changes at $25 a pop. That is $153.25 in total oil changes if I did the 7500 mile oil change. I'm not even including the fact that the filter should be replaced halfway through...
So you would save aprox. $230. That is a little chunk of change...but enough to rebuild a topend? No, I don't think so.
Lets say you do 15k mile oil changes, you save $308.25. Now thats an even bigger chunk of change, but enough to rebuild your motor? Nope.
Now I'm even counting the fact that parts to rebuild the motor is about 400...but who's going to do it? The average joe can't! I can't, but I know friends who will do it for me, even then it's going to cost a little more for a bill or two for them and pizza and beer.
So the theory that these long oil changes saves you enough money to rebuild your topend, it's not true. You save a mere 300 dollars if you do 15k mile intervals, of course its more over time, but I'm just using my exact case for an example.
The reason my oil gets so dirty is that I tow. My truck is my tow truck for now, I tow 3k# about 2x a week.
So if you guys want to save $300, I guess you can change your oil when it's chocolate black and 15000 miles...but I'd rather spend the money. I honeslty think it's being cheap not changing your oil at 3k or even 5k miles, not to mention it's lazy, and most people admit it. I'm doing the cheapest maintenance I can, thats changing oil...not that hard. TAkes me 10mins max.
The cost of the oil, say even 500 so far, is CHEAP insurrance. Compared to 2k for a rebuild.
The big difference is that the inside of my motor, besides for carbon, is pretty decently clean. I had to have a few gaskets and seals replaced, and it's pretty darn clean...compared to another ranger that was in the shop with about the same miles...who did LONG oil change intervals.
And I can guarantee if I didn't keep up on my oil, I would have had to rebuild so far...my truck has seen a lot of crap. It's been sunk, mudd(ed), etc. I am hard on it...hence why I don't mind spending the money on the oil change.
Like I said, if you think I'm crazy with my truck, I change my oil on my 4 wheeler every/every other ride depending. I only put about 12-15hrs on it between oil changes. Thats about 50 miles...crazy, I know, but top ends on those are about 1200. That oil cost me 10 a change. Cheap insurrance, I play in the water, and mud. It's a toy.
You HAVE to change your oil at some time...so lets just say this... $12/oil change...
166.66 oil changes is an engine rebuild. Thats $2000
At lets say 3000 miles an oil change that is 499,980 miles...I know my truck won't make it to that...
So how is it costing more than a top end rebuild? I'm not understanding that part? I have 82k on my truck, I bought it with 36k, so I've drove 46k miles, at 3k mile intervals that is 15.33 oil changes. At $12 a pop...thats $184 dollars in oil changes.
Now lets just say that you don't get oil for cost...it's about 25 an oil change with filter. Now it would be $383.25 so far that I've spent in oil changes. If I were to stretch that out to the $2000 mark of a top end rebuild (that 2k is just a number to use, top end rebuilds in my area are costly, mechs. know they can rape you, so they usually do) I can get 80 oil changes for $2000. So that is 3k mile intervals, that is 240,000 miles of oil changes...I doubt my engine will make it to that either, but it's good to try!
Now lets go with the "saving money aspect". You say you change oil at 7.5k miles...I have drove 46k miles on my truck.
Thats 6.13 oil changes at $25 a pop. That is $153.25 in total oil changes if I did the 7500 mile oil change. I'm not even including the fact that the filter should be replaced halfway through...
So you would save aprox. $230. That is a little chunk of change...but enough to rebuild a topend? No, I don't think so.
Lets say you do 15k mile oil changes, you save $308.25. Now thats an even bigger chunk of change, but enough to rebuild your motor? Nope.
Now I'm even counting the fact that parts to rebuild the motor is about 400...but who's going to do it? The average joe can't! I can't, but I know friends who will do it for me, even then it's going to cost a little more for a bill or two for them and pizza and beer.
So the theory that these long oil changes saves you enough money to rebuild your topend, it's not true. You save a mere 300 dollars if you do 15k mile intervals, of course its more over time, but I'm just using my exact case for an example.
The reason my oil gets so dirty is that I tow. My truck is my tow truck for now, I tow 3k# about 2x a week.
So if you guys want to save $300, I guess you can change your oil when it's chocolate black and 15000 miles...but I'd rather spend the money. I honeslty think it's being cheap not changing your oil at 3k or even 5k miles, not to mention it's lazy, and most people admit it. I'm doing the cheapest maintenance I can, thats changing oil...not that hard. TAkes me 10mins max.
The cost of the oil, say even 500 so far, is CHEAP insurrance. Compared to 2k for a rebuild.
The big difference is that the inside of my motor, besides for carbon, is pretty decently clean. I had to have a few gaskets and seals replaced, and it's pretty darn clean...compared to another ranger that was in the shop with about the same miles...who did LONG oil change intervals.
And I can guarantee if I didn't keep up on my oil, I would have had to rebuild so far...my truck has seen a lot of crap. It's been sunk, mudd(ed), etc. I am hard on it...hence why I don't mind spending the money on the oil change.
Like I said, if you think I'm crazy with my truck, I change my oil on my 4 wheeler every/every other ride depending. I only put about 12-15hrs on it between oil changes. Thats about 50 miles...crazy, I know, but top ends on those are about 1200. That oil cost me 10 a change. Cheap insurrance, I play in the water, and mud. It's a toy.
i agree a hundred percent mine is also changed every 3000 with royal purple i would rather spend that money on that then to go and rebuild the engine again
#29
11-29-2007
#30
11-29-2007
Originally Posted by Roach2004
Not arguing with you but I got a motor with 5K miles installed in my truck for 800 bucks
Even if I were to throw that in my little speech, $800, it's still cheaper to change your oil often.
Just a general statement for everyone,
Why would you not change your oil at even 5k miles? It's maintinance. I mean pretty much everyone one here has to like their truck a little bit, and everyone on here spends money on "mods". Why not spend the 25 dollars and change your damn oil??? I don't understand, I know I have 3 other followers with me, but it's not a hard concept to understand. Why would you go 20,000 miles on an oil change? Thats just letting all the contaminants run around in your bottom end (case). I mean...maybe I'm old school, but 3k miles is normal for me, 5k is way too much for me, I'd never let it go that far.
Then again I'm the guy that maintains my vehicles very well. They get washed/waxed, new brakes before they need em, ball joints at the slightest sign of wear, tie rods, etc...it's all just maintanance. Maybe b/c I get parts cheap? Labor is free b/c I do it all myself? My whole front end rebuild was under 500 including brakes and upper/lowers, tie rods, and all the little stuff.
#32
11-29-2007
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Originally Posted by Roach2004
I change it from 3K to 10K I really dont keep track as long as it looks good.
#33
11-29-2007
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#34
11-29-2007
Originally Posted by mossyoak03
i just have bad luck with engines
back in the day i had a 383 stroker in my caprice, it was ticking and losing compression when i sold it, it had 33k miles...sad sad sad.
on the other hand i had a 88 crx that had 184k miles...oil changed every3k ran like a top.
#36
11-29-2007
Member
i had an '84 mercedes 300D with the 5 cyl turbodiesel engine. it now is being driven by my son. anyhow i changed the oil over 45 times (always dino) in the
12 years i drove it. it now has about 235k miles on the original engine with no issues, very little to no blow by, and plenty of power. it takes 2 gallons of oil
in this engine, lol!
anyone that has owned german cars knows that oil is the life blood of the german engine, but if you do 'change it hot and often' they can last a very very long time. just my .02
12 years i drove it. it now has about 235k miles on the original engine with no issues, very little to no blow by, and plenty of power. it takes 2 gallons of oil
in this engine, lol!
anyone that has owned german cars knows that oil is the life blood of the german engine, but if you do 'change it hot and often' they can last a very very long time. just my .02
#37
11-29-2007
#38
11-29-2007
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Originally Posted by jrpro130
At least we are the few...and the proud!
I mean, I don't know any mechanic who changes it at more than 5k.
I would say that it's probably b/c oil for them is cheap and it's at work too though
I mean, I don't know any mechanic who changes it at more than 5k.
I would say that it's probably b/c oil for them is cheap and it's at work too though
On the other forum im on all I here is how people keep having problems with there truck at higher milage-then they list there maintnace schedules-to many miles on to much stuff
every-
3k-oil/filter
50k-tranny flush/filter
50k-coolant flush
50k-spark plugs
this is what i try to do to my truck in hopes to avoid said problems i have heard many of people speak of-for those of you who run long miles on fluids and have no problems-you have extra money in the pocket-good for you
and just a curiosity question-every one saying there oil is clean at high miles-I know some of you may-but how many actually have your oil tested for how good it is-you really cant tell just by looking at it
#39
11-29-2007
Originally Posted by jrpro130
BTW, engines that take 1qt of oil every 5k miles are not what I consider "running good". That is burning oil. Thats called blow-by (I think thats the term used, don't quote me on that...)
Blow-by is not consumption of oil. It is compression and combustion gasses leaking past the rings, which can heat and contaminate the oil. There are many ways an engine can consume oil but blow by is not one of them.
#40
11-29-2007
Originally Posted by jrpro130
Maybe you missed the part that my oil change is about $12. A top end or bottom end rebuild for that matter can cost upwards of $2k.
How the hell do you get mobil 1, a filter, and locus syn additive for 12 bucks?
Thats a 50 dollar oil change. Plus time.
Synthetic has a longer drain interval and maintaining its performance. Thats the major benefit.
You should readjust your math to the 150k mark of where im at. I have already saved the cost in oil changes vs an engine change/rebuld. The truck still runs like it did at 20k. No knocks no ticks. Just the wonderful piston slap ford built in. If I keep this engine it will last to 300k easily on 15k oil changes.
#41
11-29-2007
Originally Posted by IN2 FX4
If you think an engine that uses a 1 qt in 5,000 miles is not "running good", you don't know much about engines. That is very typical use of oil for a good running engine.
Blow-by is not consumption of oil. It is compression and combustion gasses leaking past the rings, which can heat and contaminate the oil. There are many ways an engine can consume oil but blow by is not one of them.
Blow-by is not consumption of oil. It is compression and combustion gasses leaking past the rings, which can heat and contaminate the oil. There are many ways an engine can consume oil but blow by is not one of them.
None of my engines have ever burned that much oil. I've had a few cars with well over150k and one with over 200k. On that specific car with 200k, the oil was changed at 5k intervals with no noticeable oil consumption.
I've never heard of a good running engine consuming that much oil, but what do I know, I'm just a damn medic student...I am no mechanic, thats for sure...
#42
11-29-2007
Originally Posted by Blhde
How the hell do you get mobil 1, a filter, and locus syn additive for 12 bucks?
Thats a 50 dollar oil change. Plus time.
Synthetic has a longer drain interval and maintaining its performance. Thats the major benefit.
You should readjust your math to the 150k mark of where im at. I have already saved the cost in oil changes vs an engine change/rebuld. The truck still runs like it did at 20k. No knocks no ticks. Just the wonderful piston slap ford built in. If I keep this engine it will last to 300k easily on 15k oil changes.
Thats a 50 dollar oil change. Plus time.
Synthetic has a longer drain interval and maintaining its performance. Thats the major benefit.
You should readjust your math to the 150k mark of where im at. I have already saved the cost in oil changes vs an engine change/rebuld. The truck still runs like it did at 20k. No knocks no ticks. Just the wonderful piston slap ford built in. If I keep this engine it will last to 300k easily on 15k oil changes.
I make a phone call and pick it up. The lucas is a write off from the shop I get it from, they give it to me, the mobil costs me 10 and the filter 2. It pays to know people. Lets just say that I did the shop owner a few favors, his son goes to medic school with me...and I help him study...helps to know people.
You guys keep doing your 20k mile oil changes...if you think it's no harm, do it. If the oil isn't chocolate, I don't change it, but I've never gone past 4k on my truck, ever, it's alwsy been chocolate.
If you did 3k mile intervals you would spend 2500. If you do 15k mile intervals you spend 500. Thats a little difference
I just can't get my oil to last that long, I dt' know what it is, but the longest I've pushed it is 4k and it was BLACK. I dunno...all I know is 3k works for me and I don't mind paying it b/c I have bad luck.
#43
11-30-2007
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I use Mobil 1 and change all my vehicles at 5K miles. This makes management easier because looking at the odometer and seeing a multiple of 5K means 'do it now.' Using the best stuff (synthetic) is just cheap insurance plus 'feel good.' I like 'feel good.'
The exception is my wifes Chrysler Sebring Conv. which I do at 3K due to Chrysler having serious carbon build-up issues. The dealer makes this easy by offering a lifetime rate to its customers of $19.95 for a oil/filter change. Why not do it at that price.
The exception is my wifes Chrysler Sebring Conv. which I do at 3K due to Chrysler having serious carbon build-up issues. The dealer makes this easy by offering a lifetime rate to its customers of $19.95 for a oil/filter change. Why not do it at that price.
#44
11-30-2007
#45
11-30-2007
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Oil change frequency
So far this thread has totally ignored the difference in service that the various engines see. There is a huge difference in the deteroration of oil depending on whether the engine is doing highway miles or short trip - never got totally warmed up miles. I know people who drive 30 - 50 miles one way to work who change every 10,000 miles and have good engine longevity. I know others who's oil looks like crap after 2500.
I think the driving service should influence the decision to change at 3000, 5000, or longer.
I think the driving service should influence the decision to change at 3000, 5000, or longer.
#46
11-30-2007
Member
#47
11-30-2007
Originally Posted by greygooseranger
Ricky, change your oil whenever you want, but would you be willing to do me a favor? Run your oil one time without the lucas and see how it looks after 3k. I have heard bad things about lucas. Not trying to argue or anything, just curious of the outcome...
Last oil change I made it to 3k and the oil was almost black w/ lucas, oil change before that I made it to 3k and it was decent w/ lucas, i stretched it to 4k and it was chocolatey.
This oil change i'm at 1k right now and it is clean as the day i put it in.
I have heard great and bad about lucas, it hasn't really done anything for me that I've noticed...IMO it's not worth it. I got it for free, but even then I don't want to run it...I used to run it in my race car, but that was a totally different motor. I've heard the lucas does great for carb'ed motors.
#48
11-30-2007
Member
#49
11-30-2007
Originally Posted by greygooseranger
The auto parts stores swear by it, but my mechanic tells me exactly what you said, no one notices a darn thing. He has stopped carrying it because his supplier told him that in some cases (depending on what oil its in) it may actually hurt performance...
(they sell it they make more)Honestly most people say they can't feel it. I can tell my truck has more power, but I also did a few other things to it, I didn't isolate just the lucas.
Either way, I don't think I'm running it anymore. The thing it says is that it sticks to the cylinder walls preventing "cold" startup, which the truth is it isn't much thicker than the oil I'm running (5w20)....strange. The regular lucas is THICK. I'm talking like thicker than syrup, It's almost a paste...
#50
11-30-2007
Originally Posted by Kerry
So far this thread has totally ignored the difference in service that the various engines see. There is a huge difference in the deteroration of oil depending on whether the engine is doing highway miles or short trip - never got totally warmed up miles. I know people who drive 30 - 50 miles one way to work who change every 10,000 miles and have good engine longevity. I know others who's oil looks like crap after 2500.
I think the driving service should influence the decision to change at 3000, 5000, or longer.
I think the driving service should influence the decision to change at 3000, 5000, or longer.
That being said, I really think that the best way to determine oil life is a UOA (used oil analysis). My Ranger manual says I can go 5000 miles with a conventional oil, the Civic manual recommends 7500 mile intervals - so it seems to me that 5000 miles is an appropriate run for both vehicles (driving styles considered).
Last edited by PW01; 11-30-2007 at 11:39 AM.
