Timing issues on ford ranger 97 2.3L - Ranger-Forums - The Ultimate Ford Ranger Resource


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  #1  
Old 02-13-2016
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Timing issues on ford ranger 97 2.3L

Allright, I know very, VERY little about cars, much less engine work, so please be patient, I'll try and explain this as best I can. After finding top dead center(with the belt on[I should mention the belt broke on the highway so I actually have to mess arround with the cam shaft and accessory shaft to get the marks aligned]) I took the cover off and the belt then ligned up the arrow on the camshaft and the diamond on the accessory I put the belt back on and released the tensioner which moved one of the shafts. So after a couple of days trying to figure out, we got it as close as we could to being perfect but because the tensioner snaps back the best we could do was off by 2 or 3 teeth (surely it would still start and idle?) So after puting the timing belt, the block thing that is usually under the a.c.(mine has no ac but the name escapes me), the fan and the serpentine belt back together we tried starting it (left the radiator off, considering it would be a pain to take off and put back on) jumped in, tried starting her up, it would turn over, but wouldn't start up, not to mention that we had to give it gas even though it's fuel injected (which I don't understand) if anyone could help me figure this I would appreciate any help at all!

Last edited by Vehellen; 02-13-2016 at 10:42 PM. Reason: Needed to clarify title
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Old 02-14-2016
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On older engines there were distributors, these would turn and "distribute" the spark in the correct order to each cylinders spark plug.

Distributorless engines still need some way to time when each spark plug should get spark.
That is done using the CKP(crank position) sensor.
Behind the crank pulley there will be a "tone wheel", it looks like a gear with teeth but isn't really a gear, the teeth move passed the CKP Sensor and it "counts them", 1 tooth is missing, that tells computer when TDC is.
If the CKP sensor isn't working then there can be no spark, and no fuel injection.

CPS(cam position sensor), on AUX gear, is also used but to fine tune fuel injection, it wouldn't cause a no start.

Crank/cam timing is all about compression, and compression means heat and power.
The "few teeth off" will lower compression because valves will not close at the right time to allow maximum compression in a cylinder.
When piston compresses the air/fuel mix it heats it up, if it is hot enough then a spark will ignite it, if it isn't then it won't ignite it.
On a cold engine maximum compression(heat) is needed.
Compression is also power, it is like the rubber band on a model airplane, the more you wind it up the more energy is stored, so the more energy is released when you let go of the propeller.
Higher compression = higher stored energy = more power when released.

But yes you are right, 2 or 3 teeth off shouldn't cause a no start, low power yes, but not a no start


A little confused on the last part: "not to mention that we had to give it gas even though it's fuel injected"
You said it wouldn't start, then from the above I am "kind of" reading that it did start when you added fuel manually????

If this is the case, it does start but dies, then spark is working but not fuel injectors, or there is no fuel pressure.

Fuel injectors get 12volts when key is on, test Red wire on any injector, they are all connected.
Fuel Pump should start and run for 2 seconds when key is turned on, listen for that, turn key on and off a few times, make sure you hear the fuel pump running, it is not quiet.

Last edited by RonD; 02-14-2016 at 01:11 PM.
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Old 02-14-2016
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vehellen View Post
Allright, I know very, VERY little about cars, much less engine work, so please be patient, I'll try and explain this as best I can. After finding top dead center(with the belt on[I should mention the belt broke on the highway so I actually have to mess arround with the cam shaft and accessory shaft to get the marks aligned]) I took the cover off and the belt then ligned up the arrow on the camshaft and the diamond on the accessory I put the belt back on and released the tensioner which moved one of the shafts. So after a couple of days trying to figure out, we got it as close as we could to being perfect but because the tensioner snaps back the best we could do was off by 2 or 3 teeth (surely it would still start and idle?) So after puting the timing belt, the block thing that is usually under the a.c.(mine has no ac but the name escapes me), the fan and the serpentine belt back together we tried starting it (left the radiator off, considering it would be a pain to take off and put back on) jumped in, tried starting her up, it would turn over, but wouldn't start up, not to mention that we had to give it gas even though it's fuel injected (which I don't understand) if anyone could help me figure this I would appreciate any help at all!
I think that when I release the tensioner it bumps that gear at the very bottom, but the other two gears seem to stay put, so the crank shaft and accessory are aligned but the gear on bottom is like 10-30 degrees after tdc
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Old 02-14-2016
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Originally Posted by Vehellen View Post
I think that when I release the tensioner it bumps that gear at the very bottom, but the other two gears seem to stay put, so the crank shaft and accessory are aligned but the gear on bottom is like 10-30 degrees after tdc
UPDATE now starts and idles veeeeeery rough, I have to pump the gas pedal to get it started but after it is started I can lay off the gas and it will still idle. I tried to put it in gear, reverse almost kills the engine, but first gear brings the engine up and starts a new rhythm rather than the bum bum bum bum, it does a chuck-chuck-chuck-tk-chuck chuck-chuck-chuck-tk-chuck and so on
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Old 02-14-2016
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Timing belt has only 3 gears
The large ones are the cam and AUX they are the same size.

The lower one is 1/2 the size, that's the crank gear.

Crank turns 2 times for each 1 time the cam or aux turns.

Have a look at the setup here, post #6: Timing Belt? - Ford Ranger Forum

Like setting up a distributor, shaft/rotor turns when you lower it into place because gear is angled, so with the timing belt, you know it will move when tension is applied, so you set it up so when it moves all the marks are lined up.

Cam gear doesn't move because of valve spring tension, AUX gear has oil pump tension so tends to stay put.
Crank gear has nothing to hold it since compression is only temporary, so it will move.
Trick is to put the belt on with crank timing mark offset, but cam and aux set, then when tension is applied crank turns into correct position.

If possible check compression or see if marks are still lined up they way they should be, remember you may need to rotate crank 2 times to get cam/aux gears back to their marks.
'97 2.3l should be above 160psi compression.


There is no "accelerator pump" with fuel injection, so pumping the gas pedal doesn't do what it did with a carb engine.
It does the opposite, lets more air in so less fuel in the mix, with carb you got more fuel by pumping the gas pedal.

I would make sure the IAC(idle air control) Valve got plugged back in, it should open all the way for starting the engine and then close a bit to set idle above 1,200 on cold engine.
Don't touch the gas pedal and see what happens.

On computer controlled engines you should never have to touch the gas pedal when starting.
On any startup RPMs should go high(IAC Valve open all the way), then drop to match engine temp idle
cold engine above 1,200
warm engine 700
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  #6  
Old 02-15-2016
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Didnt see this one

Quote:
Originally Posted by RonD View Post
On older engines there were distributors, these would turn and "distribute" the spark in the correct order to each cylinders spark plug.

Distributorless engines still need some way to time when each spark plug should get spark.
That is done using the CKP(crank position) sensor.
Behind the crank pulley there will be a "tone wheel", it looks like a gear with teeth but isn't really a gear, the teeth move passed the CKP Sensor and it "counts them", 1 tooth is missing, that tells computer when TDC is.
If the CKP sensor isn't working then there can be no spark, and no fuel injection.

CPS(cam position sensor), on AUX gear, is also used but to fine tune fuel injection, it wouldn't cause a no start.

Crank/cam timing is all about compression, and compression means heat and power.
The "few teeth off" will lower compression because valves will not close at the right time to allow maximum compression in a cylinder.
When piston compresses the air/fuel mix it heats it up, if it is hot enough then a spark will ignite it, if it isn't then it won't ignite it.
On a cold engine maximum compression(heat) is needed.
Compression is also power, it is like the rubber band on a model airplane, the more you wind it up the more energy is stored, so the more energy is released when you let go of the propeller.
Higher compression = higher stored energy = more power when released.

But yes you are right, 2 or 3 teeth off shouldn't cause a no start, low power yes, but not a no start


A little confused on the last part: "not to mention that we had to give it gas even though it's fuel injected"
You said it wouldn't start, then from the above I am "kind of" reading that it did start when you added fuel manually????

If this is the case, it does start but dies, then spark is working but not fuel injectors, or there is no fuel pressure.

Fuel injectors get 12volts when key is on, test Red wire on any injector, they are all connected.
Fuel Pump should start and run for 2 seconds when key is turned on, listen for that, turn key on and off a few times, make sure you hear the fuel pump running, it is not quiet.

Yes, we added fuel manually, today I actually started it without adding fuel, the engine bogs(right word?) But it will stay in idle until I give it gas, in which case the engine tries to die, makes sense considering what you just said. It starts up though, but with barely enough power to move (I did put it in gear today and was barely able to rock it back and forth) thanks for your responses, sorry I didn't see this one sooner
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  #7  
Old 02-17-2016
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Hey ya, sorry, all my comments seem to need moderater approval, so that's why I don't seem to be replying, I'll try and retype them in as soon as I get off work.
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