SAS Front Axle ? - Ranger-Forums - The Ultimate Ford Ranger Resource


Solid Axle Swaps General discussion of solid axle swaps for the Ford Ranger.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #1  
Old 01-07-2013
98'4x4ranger's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Westerly, RI
Posts: 20
SAS Front Axle ?

Hello. Let me start out by saying im new to this forum. Been a member on RPS for some time now, but no one likes to help over there. At least it seems that way. Hopefully you guys are a nicer group of guys (and gals) over here.

Anyway on to my questions. Been planning a SAS for some time now. Have considered a few options for front axles. At first it was a dana 30 because where I live they are easy to come by etc. But recently was reading up on shortening the dana 44 HP from a 78-79 f150. I understand how to shorten it.

What I don't understand is after shortening the tube, do you have to grind the weld on the driver side knuckle too. So that the knuckles can be rotated to set pinion angle appropriate for 6"+ of lift?? Or do you just weld the knuckle back in the normal location and there is another way to achieve the correct pinion angle???

Also on the same f150 d44 there are wedges that I believe are for the radius arms?? Some are cast into the axle some are welded. My question would be would I have to weld them back on if I am doing coil overs and a 3 link?? This is that I find an axle that has the wedges welded on.

Any advice on where to look for my answers, or if someone already has answers it would be very well appreciated seemings how there is a f150 d44 not too far from me for sale right now.

Thanks again.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 01-07-2013
Red_Ak_Ranger's Avatar
RF Veteran
iTrader: (1)
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 17,221
Not many people have the experience to properly answer your questions but if you search this forum you'll find build threads on SAS rangers that would likely carry the answers.

Also look into the early bronco D44. Easy to swap under a ranger.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 01-07-2013
Scrambler82's Avatar
Old Guy Userů ltr
iTrader: (12)
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SoCal
Posts: 6,773
If you have the experience to alter an high pinion D44 it would be be better for driveshaft angle.

The pinion angle... First fond out if there are any alignment bushings for the radius arms that match up to the lift you are thinking about, then if nothing is available it might be an easy alignment of the tube but you need the alignment of the center of the tubes to the center of the axle position in the differential.

If it was me I would look into get the housing cut and welded by a pro shop, they will know the best way to alter the pinion angle.

As stated above, search the site and check out the other posts on the SAS setups.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 01-07-2013
2004xlmiller's Avatar
Member
iTrader: (5)
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Sac, CA
Posts: 1,601
sub'd. considering shortening a D44 for my CJ as opposed to running full widths..
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 01-07-2013
98'4x4ranger's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Westerly, RI
Posts: 20
well I have to shorten the axle if i went with the f150 d44. Here in RI cops can be real PITA's when it comes to tires poking out.

I was considering it because it is 5x5.5 and yukon and superior have the double drilled axles that have the 5x5.5 bolts in there c-clip eliminator kits for the 8.8. And the f150 d44 has 1/2" thick axle tubes which is a plus when it comes to rocks. Also can run stock axles with 35-36" tire and be fine.

As far as the EB d44 it doesn't swap into my truck easy. The 97 and before trucks with the TTB suspension they do. I have torsion bars so any solid axle is going to be a PITA. But my main concern right now is getting the axles built.

And for the lift me and my buddy are gonna fab everything once i take all my measurments and figure out the lengths of my links and where they need to be, but like i said my main concern at the time is building the axles.

And i have been looking threw the threads but haven't seen anything close to what i have in mind.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 01-07-2013
98'4x4ranger's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Westerly, RI
Posts: 20
also was thinking about steering, kind of off subject but why does everyone use a yota steering box or the others? The 97 and older rangers used a steering box and since i have a 4.0 the power steering pump is in the same place and could use the lines and steering shaft for the box no? Just been wondering why i have yet to see someone do it this way. Im probably missing something??
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 01-07-2013
Scrambler82's Avatar
Old Guy Userů ltr
iTrader: (12)
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SoCal
Posts: 6,773
Quote:
Originally Posted by 98'4x4ranger View Post
well I have to shorten the axle if i went with the f150 d44.
Just a suggestion, make sure of the available axle shaft lengths before cutting the axle housing down.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 01-07-2013
98'4x4ranger's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Westerly, RI
Posts: 20
I was probably just going to send the stock passenger side shaft to the machine shop and have it shortened since it has the bigger 297 u joints. I havent really looked into it too much because the whole pinion angle thing still confuses me.

But was going to shorten it 6" on passenger side as that seems to work the best.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 01-08-2013
98'4x4ranger's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Westerly, RI
Posts: 20
Thanks for the links Red. I already read the last one actually have it saved on my phone lol. But all the vehicles they do it on are TTB suspension and I have torsion bars so thats where I get confused because my frame is set up different.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 01-09-2013
98'4x4ranger's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Westerly, RI
Posts: 20
Ok so I have made up my mind on the front axle. Going to go with the f150 HP D44 like 76-77' with the welded wedges so which ever route i go (3 link or radius arm) I have that option. Found a place not to far from me that will shorten the tube and shorten and respline the axle for 425.

So have a few more questions and not sure were to look for answers. Or even what to search for to get answers.

I plan on doing coilovers, so one questions would be how to remove the coil buckets off the axle because from what I have read they are casted on???

Next would be what would my options be if the axle I get happens to have a casted on panhard bar mount as I plan on wheeling my truck (no longer a DD) and want to put high steering on it??

Most important question is where can I look to find the correct pinion angle to lift measurements?? Last I remember was for about 6" of lift you need about 6-7 degrees of pinion angle? Reason I ask is the shop that is going to shorten it is also going to reweld the knuckles to fix the caster.

Any help appreciated. Thanks again,
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 01-09-2013
Red_Ak_Ranger's Avatar
RF Veteran
iTrader: (1)
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 17,221
Check out Pirate4x4.Com - The largest off roading website in the world. You cant expect to get these answers randomly online from a post. You kind of have to earn from others experiences and build threads
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 01-09-2013
98'4x4ranger's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Westerly, RI
Posts: 20
Ok ill check there tomorrow and see how far i get. Thanks
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 01-09-2013
brinker88's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Williamsport, Pa
Posts: 175
I just finished shortening my Dana 44. I cut exactly 6" off of it so I can use an Early Bronco long inner shaft.

To set proper pinion angle on the wedge type ford axles, they use bushings with different degrees in them @ the attatching point of the radius arms on the axle. 7 degree bushings are common for 6" + lifts.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 01-09-2013
RazorsEDGE's Avatar
There's no lifeguard in the gene pool
iTrader: (4)
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: New Mexico
Posts: 7,501
On 98+ Rangers I'd recommend running the axle full width. There just isn't enough room for brackets and whatnot when running a shortened axle or a skinnier axle like a d30 or EB d44. I know you're in a position that state law may make that difficult, but consider fender flares or something. I would only shorten the axle as an absolute last resort, because it will make it much harder to get things where you want them with a short axle.

Also, as far as why everyone runs a yota box on their swaps....It's because the yota box is designed to mount outside the framerails. On the 98+ trucks there isn't much room to mount any kind of steering box inside the rails. Can it be done? Yes, but it's much easier to use a box on the outside of the frame.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 01-09-2013
RazorsEDGE's Avatar
There's no lifeguard in the gene pool
iTrader: (4)
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: New Mexico
Posts: 7,501
Quote:
Originally Posted by 98'4x4ranger View Post
I plan on doing coilovers, so one questions would be how to remove the coil buckets off the axle because from what I have read they are casted on???
They are welded, cut em off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 98'4x4ranger View Post
Next would be what would my options be if the axle I get happens to have a casted on panhard bar mount as I plan on wheeling my truck (no longer a DD) and want to put high steering on it??
Nothing should be cast except wedges.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 98'4x4ranger View Post
Most important question is where can I look to find the correct pinion angle to lift measurements?? Last I remember was for about 6" of lift you need about 6-7 degrees of pinion angle? Reason I ask is the shop that is going to shorten it is also going to reweld the knuckles to fix the caster.

Any help appreciated. Thanks again,
If you're planning on a 3 link you don't need to worry about pinion angle being related to lift. Get an angle finder and set your pinion angle to 4*
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 01-10-2013
brinker88's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Williamsport, Pa
Posts: 175
78/79 F150 dana 44s HAVE a cast on lower panhard bar mount. Cut it off and weld on a different one with double shear.

If you want to go high steer like I am, you need chevy stub shafts (9-15/16" long), chevy small bearing spindles,chevy caliper brackets, and chevy high steer knuckles (driver side will need to be machined, drilled/tapped). This allows you to use your ford rotor and hub.

Google Mr. N dana 44. That website has the best information on Dana 44's.

Here's my high steer chevy knuckle on a ford axle:



As for 3 linking it, I would suggest using a 3 link calculator to determine your link locations/angles. Don't forget to box your frame in as the 3 link creates massive forces in that area. Set your caster on the axle for 3-7 degrees back. Burn the inner C's in, and tack weld your link mounts on. Slide the axle up and determine the location for the frame mounts and how long your links will be. I would suggest putting your third link on the passenger side.
Attached Thumbnails
SAS Front Axle ?-543881_4736101332500_2114143610_n.jpg  
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 01-11-2013
98'4x4ranger's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Westerly, RI
Posts: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by brinker88 View Post
I just finished shortening my Dana 44. I cut exactly 6" off of it so I can use an Early Bronco long inner shaft.

To set proper pinion angle on the wedge type ford axles, they use bushings with different degrees in them @ the attatching point of the radius arms on the axle. 7 degree bushings are common for 6" + lifts.
Ok thanks for the info. Was not really familiar with radius arm suspension until I really started looking into the f150 axle.

Im leaning more toward shortening it right now but not the whole 6" because the place I'd send it to will shorten the f150 axle so I can run the 297 joints. Probably get about 4 or so inches taken off to get it anywhere from 60.5-61.5" wide. Ill be running an expo 8.8 out back with c clip eliminator so if my math is right 8.8 should be 60.5 wms to wms.

thanks again
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 01-11-2013
98'4x4ranger's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Westerly, RI
Posts: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by RazorsEDGE View Post
On 98+ Rangers I'd recommend running the axle full width. There just isn't enough room for brackets and whatnot when running a shortened axle or a skinnier axle like a d30 or EB d44. I know you're in a position that state law may make that difficult, but consider fender flares or something. I would only shorten the axle as an absolute last resort, because it will make it much harder to get things where you want them with a short axle.

Also, as far as why everyone runs a yota box on their swaps....It's because the yota box is designed to mount outside the framerails. On the 98+ trucks there isn't much room to mount any kind of steering box inside the rails. Can it be done? Yes, but it's much easier to use a box on the outside of the frame.
As far as shortening axle you will see my other post. My trails around where I live is just to narrow with full width id never get around. I have hard enough time now because its an extended cab lol.

And with the yota box I did notice it outside frame. Im used to seeing steering boxes on the inside kinda threw me off. Im still wondering if anyone has considered using stuff off the 97 and below rangers, or is the frame that different that it wont fit?? Everything else the same pretty much (motor,trans,etc) if donor truck is an auto that is.

Thanks for the input
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 01-11-2013
98'4x4ranger's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Westerly, RI
Posts: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by brinker88 View Post
78/79 F150 dana 44s HAVE a cast on lower panhard bar mount. Cut it off and weld on a different one with double shear.

If you want to go high steer like I am, you need chevy stub shafts (9-15/16" long), chevy small bearing spindles,chevy caliper brackets, and chevy high steer knuckles (driver side will need to be machined, drilled/tapped). This allows you to use your ford rotor and hub.

Google Mr. N dana 44. That website has the best information on Dana 44's.

Here's my high steer chevy knuckle on a ford axle:



As for 3 linking it, I would suggest using a 3 link calculator to determine your link locations/angles. Don't forget to box your frame in as the 3 link creates massive forces in that area. Set your caster on the axle for 3-7 degrees back. Burn the inner C's in, and tack weld your link mounts on. Slide the axle up and determine the location for the frame mounts and how long your links will be. I would suggest putting your third link on the passenger side.
I found that Mr. N website good info. Was a little confusing as I'm new at this still learning all the terms. Ill need to go back and read it slower. lol

And I want to go high steer because I will wheel it, so do i still need panhard bar or??

I tried to find a link calulator but didnt really have any luck Ill search some more. And do you mean box the whole front frame or just at where links will attach to frame?? Because i figured i would need to box anything where it attaches to the frame. And my whole goal was to get the axle set up on jack stands with the caster and pinion because i use my truck for work as well and dont want to tear it apart until axle ready to go under it.
And correct me if im wrong but doesnt your 3rd link control pinion? and the straighter it is facing the pumpkin the better?

Sorry if my questions are considered "newbie" ones but I want to do this correct the first time. Thanks for info
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 01-11-2013
brinker88's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Williamsport, Pa
Posts: 175
No problem. I narrowed mine 6" so I don't have to get a custom shaft made for the long side inner. And with the flat top knuckle conversion I'm doing, it makes the axle slightly wider. I'm running the expo 8.8 and they're already wider than the OE 28 spline 8.8
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 01-11-2013
98'4x4ranger's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Westerly, RI
Posts: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by brinker88 View Post
No problem. I narrowed mine 6" so I don't have to get a custom shaft made for the long side inner. And with the flat top knuckle conversion I'm doing, it makes the axle slightly wider. I'm running the expo 8.8 and they're already wider than the OE 28 spline 8.8
Well the place in Mass. i would bring it to its 425 to shortrn tube and axle so thats a fair price I think. And down the road if I want to upgrade to chromo axles they make custom sets for 400. Im basically trying to get front to match back.

And ya expo 8.8 is 1.25" wider than ranger 8.8 in stock form. Then you add the c clip eliminator kit and thats another inch. So all in all technically 2.25" wider.

And when you say flat top knuckle conversion that is for high steer right?? Are you running aftermarket knuckles? Or doing like the chevy knuckles and having pass. side machined?
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 01-11-2013
brinker88's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Williamsport, Pa
Posts: 175
That's a little rediculous for shortening an axle. I have maybe 3 hours total into shortening it. And dutchman axles online will make you a custom axle for around $150. You would just need to have someone weld the inner C back on for you.

I'm running chevy knuckles. Passenger side needed to be machined/drilled/tapped. I got lucky and scored a chevy Dana 44 with both knuckles machined with a set of SKYY manufacturing high steer arms, spindles, caliper brackets, etc. for $125.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 01-11-2013
98'4x4ranger's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Westerly, RI
Posts: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by brinker88 View Post
That's a little rediculous for shortening an axle. I have maybe 3 hours total into shortening it. And dutchman axles online will make you a custom axle for around $150. You would just need to have someone weld the inner C back on for you.

I'm running chevy knuckles. Passenger side needed to be machined/drilled/tapped. I got lucky and scored a chevy Dana 44 with both knuckles machined with a set of SKYY manufacturing high steer arms, spindles, caliper brackets, etc. for $125.
Well this is the only place i found kinda close to me? And its still hr and a half drive. And y risk messing it up this place will do everything all under one roof. Being in RI I don't have many choices.

And that is a score but where I live those kind of deals never happen. If they do it is very rare.

Do the knuckles come off a full size like 1500?
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 01-11-2013
brinker88's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Williamsport, Pa
Posts: 175
Yup. 1973-1976.5 chevy K10's

I have an extra set of knuckles if you're interested in them. The passenger side still needs machined though. Send it out to PartsMike and he'll do it for $50 + the ride. PM me if you're interested in them.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Biltrites axle builds and eventual sas BILTRITE BULLIES Project Logs 595 04-07-2016 07:18 PM
sas rock assualt axle mxcorona199 Snapshots 46 01-11-2012 11:46 PM
Best axle for a SAS? APell14 Solid Axle Swaps 7 03-20-2011 04:07 PM
SAS Guys: CHECK THOSE AXLE VENTS!!! n3elz Drivetrain Tech 19 04-28-2008 07:29 PM
SAS axle help sem1845 General Ford Ranger Discussion 13 02-12-2006 11:22 PM


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:29 AM.


We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.