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  #1  
Old 10-16-2008
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Carbon deposit question

Up until i changed to a higher octaine fuel, i had been having a audible metal shreding, marbles rolling whatever you want to call it, sound coming from my engine.

Under the advice of others to determine the problem, i upgraded form 87 to 93 octaine and the problem went away. This lead me to believe that i needed to sea foam my truck.

Now today i went and changed my plugs and wires and when i pulled my old plugs out, with the exception of a little high speed glazing, there were no carbon deposits.

So the question is, with the plugs having not been changed in god knows how long, possibly 90,000 miles haha, could this have been my problem all along?

I havent really driven much to find out, nor have i switched to a lower ocatine fuel to see if my wonderful noise comes back.

Thanks
David
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Old 10-16-2008
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Since you have been using a K&N filter and intake, your MAF sensor is probably contaminated with dirt & oil, which causes a lean condition, resulting in pre-ignition (pinging). Your IAC valve, and throttle body are
probably gummed up too.

But, for the pinging problem, try cleaning your MAF sensor, and go back to the OEM paper filter. I've got >150K miles on my 1999 3.0L, always used Motorcraft or
Purolator paper air filters, and have never had to clean my MAF sensor, IAC valve, or throttle body.

As you can see from this thread (post #7), Rich is running the same intake, and has to clean his throttle body often (several times in 35K miles):

https://www.ranger-forums.com/forum2...+throttle+body

Last edited by Takeda; 10-16-2008 at 05:33 AM.
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  #3  
Old 10-16-2008
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well thing is i had this problem before i put the intake on my truck.

I have cleaned the MAF sensor many times. Thanks for the help though! I appreciate it
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Old 10-16-2008
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The K&N intake would not be cause a problem unless you over oiled it.

Possibly the old plugs could have been your problem.
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  #5  
Old 10-16-2008
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Ford "Chatter"

Honestly I have had a chattering sound coming from the engine of my truck since long as I can remeber, she runs sound though, never any issues and just rolled over 93 k...dont know my neighbor who is a mechanic calls it the Ford chatter...is this Ok or is something wrong...you got me haha? maybe your talking about a differnt sound though....!
1999 3.0 L
had an 88 f-150 302 V8 same sound, she ran great too, just couldn't afford the gas.
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  #6  
Old 10-16-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fddriver02 View Post
The K&N intake would not be cause a problem unless you over oiled it.
I'm sure Rich doesn't over oil his, and as you can see from his post in this
thread, he has to clean very often:

https://www.ranger-forums.com/forum2/...+throttle+body
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  #7  
Old 10-16-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeda View Post
I'm sure Rich doesn't over oil his, and as you can see from his post in this
thread, he has to clean very often:

https://www.ranger-forums.com/forum2/...+throttle+body
So you are saying the K&N intake is the problem just because he cleans his TB often? Sorry, you lose. Unless you have proof, not internet links I want your test data, then I don't believe it. What I do believe is that when I went to put my K&N and my truck it needed cleaning then. I still believe the problem is the PCV system. My friend has a catch can along with a K&N FIPK on his GTO and after two years of having that setup we pulled it off because we though it needed cleaning but it was clean. There is my test data. Real world testing.

Anyway, try the lower octane again and see if it happens.
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  #8  
Old 10-16-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fddriver02 View Post
So you are saying the K&N intake is the problem just because he cleans his TB often? Sorry, you lose. Unless you have proof, not internet links I want your test data, then I don't believe it. What I do believe is that when I went to put my K&N and my truck it needed cleaning then. I still believe the problem is the PCV system. My friend has a catch can along with a K&N FIPK on his GTO and after two years of having that setup we pulled it off because we though it needed cleaning but it was clean. There is my test data. Real world testing.

Anyway, try the lower octane again and see if it happens.
Sorry, I DON'T LOOSE...............

Check out this thread:


https://www.ranger-forums.com/forum2...t=K%26N+intake



Here is post # 17 from Rich, who claims to be a big fan of aftermarket intake kits:





I'm a big fan of aftermarket intake kits. (have one on my Ranger) But only because of high rpm power increases. If your not interested in 5000+ rpms.. don't waste your money.

You won't see a MPG increase as compaired to a properly working OEM setup.
You will *likely* increase the amount of grit entering the intake.
You very well might have the warrenty denied.
And your pretty much waisting money for a daily driver.
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Old 10-16-2008
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Wow. A actual good source. I'm proud of you. In the end I would still buy one and you still lose because you joined a Ranger modding site where 95% of the people here have mods done to their trucks and you spread your "OEM is best" crap everywhere where no one wants to hear it.
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  #10  
Old 10-16-2008
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Originally Posted by fddriver02 View Post
In the end I would still buy one and you still lose .

Nope, your the one with the lighter wallet, NOT ME!!!!

Also posted by Rich, regarding aftermarket intakes:

And your pretty much waisting money for a daily driver.
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Old 10-16-2008
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And last time I checked you are still on a Ranger modding site and we spend our money the way we want to spend it. Intake, exhaust, lift kits you name it. We do it because we want to and your preaching wont stop it.
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Old 10-16-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeda View Post
As you can see from this thread (post #7), Rich is running the same intake, and has to clean his throttle body often (several times in 35K miles):

https://www.ranger-forums.com/forum2...+throttle+body
Again with the out of context conclusions from Bob.

I clean my TB & MAF because I'm **** about maintainence. Not because I have to.

The only reason a K&N would do that is if it were over oiled. Was this the case?


And btw.. Bob a little debris on the MAF won't cause it to run so lean as to cause tip in knock. You sir continue to speak on things you know nothing about. A/F is directly controlled by the 02s. The MAF sensor plays a part.. but only a small part. Shoot, you can dis-connect the MAF and it'll run w/o it.


Tip in knock (or moderate throttle knock) is usually due to carbon build up on the valve stems and the combustion chamber.



Rich

Last edited by wydopnthrtl; 10-16-2008 at 01:16 PM.
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Old 10-16-2008
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[QUOTE=And btw.. Bob a little debris on the MAF won't cause it to run so lean as to cause tip in knock. You sir continue to speak on things you know nothing about. A/F is directly controlled by the 02s. The MAF sensor plays a part.. but only a small part. Shoot, you can dis-connect the MAF and it'll run w/o it.
Rich[/QUOTE]

my maf took a **** and wouldnt run right with it plugged in so i ran it unplugged for almost 3 months till i got a new one yes my gas mileage went down but it ran better then i got a new maf and it ran even better and gets 20 mpg
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Old 10-16-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wydopnthrtl View Post
Again with the out of context conclusions from Bob.

I clean my TB & MAF because I'm **** about maintainence. Not because I have to.

The only reason a K&N would do that is if it were over oiled. Was this the case?


And btw.. Bob a little debris on the MAF won't cause it to run so lean as to cause tip in knock. You sir continue to speak on things you know nothing about. A/F is directly controlled by the 02s. The MAF sensor plays a part.. but only a small part. Shoot, you can dis-connect the MAF and it'll run w/o it.


Tip in knock (or moderate throttle knock) is usually due to carbon build up on the valve stems and the combustion chamber.



Rich


Rich, when you disconnect the MAF sensor, the PCM goes into "limp home mode", so it will run without the MAF sensor ok........

Now, explain how carbon on the valve stems raises the compression to
cause pre-ignition????

And Rich, I'm not going to get into another PI$$ING contest with you, but it sounds like you have about as much understanding of a MAF sensor as you do a thermostat!!!

A dirty MAF sensor WILL cause pre-ignition, AND IT WILL SET LEAN CODES. And F.W.I.W., the signal from the O2 sensors isn't even used in OPEN-LOOP,
which happens at WOT:

http://d-tips.com/General/Articles/a...ow_Testing.art

http://www.therangerstation.com/tech.../CleanMAF.html

http://www.spydermagazine.com/2002/M.../maf_clean.htm

http://en.allexperts.com/q/Ford-Repa...7-Town-Car.htm

http://ford.justanswer.com/ranger/18...ger-4-0-engine

http://www.speedbitz.com/listing/151...ensor_cleaner/

http://www.explorerforum.com/Singlet...ages/ping.html


This goes along with your understanding of using an e-fan with a 4core radiator!!!

Last edited by Takeda; 10-16-2008 at 03:51 PM.
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  #15  
Old 10-16-2008
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haha i feel so special, ive got a debate going in one of my threads! Ill try the lower ocatine again but im 100% its not my intake since it was doing this before i ever had one. I dont oil the filter either since its only a few months old.

Providing its not the old plugs, any suggestions on what else it could be? just a whole bunch of what if's going on at the moment
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  #16  
Old 10-16-2008
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I had a K&N filter, lightley oiled, and I got a lean code several times. I would clean the MAF and it would stay gone for a while, then come back. I finally bought an AEM dryflo filter and cleaned the MAF again, and it has not been back.
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  #17  
Old 10-16-2008
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one way to eliminate the intake is to ask did the sound get worse after you put it on?

Let us know how she runs after the new plugs, wires and lower octane.

I hope its nothing serious Dave. Its been a long time since Ive seen you or even talked to you.


Also Ive ran the panel filter and now my open element and have never had a problem with my MAF or codes beeing tripped.
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  #18  
Old 10-16-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rapala View Post
one way to eliminate the intake is to ask did the sound get worse after you put it on?

Let us know how she runs after the new plugs, wires and lower octane.

I hope its nothing serious Dave. Its been a long time since Ive seen you or even talked to you.


Also Ive ran the panel filter and now my open element and have never had a problem with my MAF or codes beeing tripped.
It took over a year before I had any come up at first. It doesn't happen over night from putting it on.
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Old 10-16-2008
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yeah I know that... I ran a panel filter for more than 3 years... and ive had the open element on for a few months and I can only expect the same... but Im not worried till I see something change
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Old 10-16-2008
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yea phil its been a while. The works been piling on like a mother and it keeps getting worse.

I think the plugs and wires may have done it cause so far so good. All i need to do is put the 87 octane tune on and that will be my definite answer. Hopefully i wont have to seafoam my truck...too much work and labor and worrying if i did it right haha
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Old 10-16-2008
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Dave I would invest in the AEM Dryflo filter, 50 bucks and you never have to worry about it again.
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Old 10-16-2008
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Seafoaming your truck will take all of 10 minutes, and undoing one hose clamp. DO IT! Even if it is not the only thing causing your problem, after 90K miles, it will make a difference. I did it at 70K with no issues, just to see, and I saw a difference. So just to reiterate, you should PROLLY do it!
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Old 10-16-2008
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I should do it then. I heard you should change plugs after tho, is that true?
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  #24  
Old 10-17-2008
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yea i do know seafoam fouls the plugs for sure...my room mate has used it on some of his cars and said so.
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Old 10-17-2008
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Originally Posted by Plyswthsqurles View Post
yea i do know seafoam fouls the plugs for sure...my room mate has used it on some of his cars and said so.
I've also wondered what the carbon debris does to the O2 sensors, and CATs? I have heard that the oil should also be changed after a seafoam treatment.

Last edited by Takeda; 10-17-2008 at 05:40 AM.
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