351w in 98+ rangers anyone have advice? - Ranger-Forums - The Ultimate Ford Ranger Resource


8-Cylinder Tech If you are one of the few with a V8 engine in your Ranger, or if you dream of a Ranger with a V8 engine, this is the sub-forum for you.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #1  
Old 01-22-2013
05edge's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: campton/milan nh
Posts: 901
351w in 98+ rangers anyone have advice?

im getting ready to do a mild build on a 351w for my truck. i dont really need help with the engine build as i do with fitting it in the truck. it has been done a lot more on pre 98 trucks but only a few have been done on 98+ so theres not much info on it. does anyone have any experience on this or know of anyone? any help is much appreciated!

for the 351w build itself, its getting fully rebuilt .030 over with a mild cam, ported gt40 heads, 650cfm carb, upgraded ignition, and maybe intake manifold. should be in the 300hp/400tq range.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 01-22-2013
Scrambler82's Avatar
Old Guy Userů ltr
iTrader: (12)
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SoCal
Posts: 6,780
I have never done a 351 but being that they are taller and wider than a 302 you will need to remove more stuff from the engine compartment.
Custom headers will be needed and I am not sure if they will fit inside of the frame rails; 302s need a slight mod’g of the frame for headers in the 97 Gen back Ranger but not sure how that will affect the ‘98+.
The radiator will have to be larger than the 302 version for proper cooling, a 302 Adapter Radiator will probably work but on the trail you will never know until it overheats.
Since your truck is jacked up, cooling will be affected by two air flow paths, through the radiator and from underneath, actually reducing the air flow and causing the engine to run hotter.


If you don’t mind, why a 351, you have probably heard this before but a well built 302 will produce a lot of HP and the torque, although lower than the 351, will be plenty, especially if the truck is geared properly. The 302 will be far easier to install and get headers for.

Good Luck on the project.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 01-22-2013
05edge's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: campton/milan nh
Posts: 901
Icon10

i think if i told you what this trucks build purpose is then it might help you help me. this truck is being built for mud bogs. its not for the street although i will be keeping it "street legal" with the help of good friends being the ones doing the inspection, so i have that option but rarely will it see pavement. i dont really trail ride it anymore, it usually sits until the next event, or if theres a nice mud hole to go play in.

with that being said, the engine compartment is getting completely stripped. i know the block will fit in-between the rails and i also know that the headers will not. the block is 2" wider then a 302 at the heads, taller isnt an issue. im going to be making my own set of long tubes. the radiator is getting mounted on the roll bar in the bed with electric fans.

a 351w having a longer stroke will make tons more toque then a 302 will ever. a 302 just wont cut it. i do agree a 302 can be built to make some decent numbers but your limited. im eventually going to pull the motor back out to do a 408 stroker, dana 60's, and some none dot 44 tractor tires strictly for mud. and lets be honest here, the reason why everyone and their grandmother does a 302, is because its the easiest. thats one big reason for me not to do it.

thank you for your input, i do appreciate it! everything helps
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 01-22-2013
01RangerEdge's Avatar
Scrambles the DeathDealer
iTrader: (11)
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Jackson, MO
Posts: 7,598
I've seen a 460 in a 98+ Ranger, so I don't think the 351W will be a problem. Especially since everything is getting stripped out
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 01-22-2013
Scrambler82's Avatar
Old Guy Userů ltr
iTrader: (12)
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SoCal
Posts: 6,780
Quote:
Originally Posted by 05edge View Post
i think if i told you what this trucks build purpose is then it might help you help me. this truck is being built for:
Ok then ... 351W it is and good choice !

Have you done any frame work for mud drags ?
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 01-22-2013
05edge's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: campton/milan nh
Posts: 901
Quote:
Originally Posted by 01RangerEdge View Post
I've seen a 460 in a 98+ Ranger, so I don't think the 351W will be a problem. Especially since everything is getting stripped out
iv seen videos but have never looked into any builds. i have no idea if they cut the frame rails out and tube bend their own, or if the are able to fit them in on stock rails. either way its reassuring.

Scrambler82,
i agree, i think the Windsor is the perfect choice for what i want. not too big but big enough, and its such a good platform.

i dont know if ill ever enter any of the drags but i love doing the bogs. this is the biggest baddest event around check it out Previous Event Photos :www.Vermonster4x4.com but as for frame work ill be pulling the bed of and probably just brace it up for now. when the funds allow it ill build a full tube chassis.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 01-22-2013
05edge's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: campton/milan nh
Posts: 901
i love this picture. just look at that pit you can see why i need an engine upgrade haha
Attached Thumbnails
351w in 98+ rangers anyone have advice?-1.jpg  
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 01-22-2013
seed60's Avatar
RF Veteran
iTrader: (15)
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Mooresville, NC
Posts: 5,584
Don't know anything about that but lets see some new pics of the truck. That hole looks nasty.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 01-22-2013
99DangerRanger's Avatar
Level III Supporter
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: New Creek, WV
Posts: 441
That hole looks like bigger axles and tires need to be in the near future as well. x2 on the updated picture also.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 01-22-2013
05edge's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: campton/milan nh
Posts: 901
alight ill start another thread with some new pictures. i gotta ***** it a bit haha i havent been around for awhile.

i dont think my truck will ever make it through that pit. right now im in the 35-44 dot approved class and i didnt want to go any bigger tires on these axles. with the new motor i have a good chance at winning. i do have chromoly shafts so when they break ill upgrade.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 01-23-2013
The SuperDookie Ranger's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
Posts: 817
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scrambler82 View Post
Since your truck is jacked up, cooling will be affected by two air flow paths, through the radiator and from underneath, actually reducing the air flow and causing the engine to run hotter.
Please explain how being lifted and having airflow from underneath will cause the engine to run hotter? My truck is lifted with the splash guards removed from the fender wells and the front bumper valance is removed allowing more air to reach the engine. My 5.0 is still cooled by the 4.0 radiator and an e-fan and it runs way cooler than normal operating temperature, especially on the highway. I hardly turn the fan on unless the truck is sitting still.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 01-23-2013
Scrambler82's Avatar
Old Guy Userů ltr
iTrader: (12)
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SoCal
Posts: 6,780
Quote:
Originally Posted by The SuperDookie Ranger View Post
Please explain how being lifted and having airflow from underneath will cause the engine to run hotter?
Exactly how mine was too but only 4.5" lift and no air dam.
When the air come in through the radiator and up from underneath of the truck both flows hit and reduce the overall movement of air in the engine bay and through the radiator.

I think you are saying the flow under the truck will have no effect on the flow through the radiator but it will.

Proof... I lifted the rear of my hood approx one inch, maybe a little moe, and reduced my engine temp by 10-15 degrees. (Sort of a poor man's Cowl Induction Hood)

The engine ran at normal temp around town where you would think the reduce speed would reduce the air flow and cooling but in turn at speed on the highway is where the air increased coming in from the bottom and reduced the cooling capacity of the radiator by restricting the flow through the radiator.

I was at wits end trying to figure out why my truck was running hotter on the highway than around town. A friend of a friend, a Ford Engineer, told me right away what I had done... lifted and removed the air dam.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 01-24-2013
05edge's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: campton/milan nh
Posts: 901
anyone else have any info? my truck doesnt have the pats system so i should be able to wire right into my stock wiring with no problems right? is there anyway i can wire in my stock computer just for hooking up to ob2 for inspection? i planned on using another truck to plug in as mine but if i can make my computer think its working id rather do that if its even possible.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 01-25-2013
01RangerEdge's Avatar
Scrambles the DeathDealer
iTrader: (11)
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Jackson, MO
Posts: 7,598
I thought you weren't worried about inspection?
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 01-25-2013
05edge's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: campton/milan nh
Posts: 901
Quote:
Originally Posted by 05edge View Post
i planned on using another truck to plug in as mine but if i can make my computer think its working id rather do that if its even possible.
And I thought you could read...
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 01-25-2013
01RangerEdge's Avatar
Scrambles the DeathDealer
iTrader: (11)
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Jackson, MO
Posts: 7,598
Quote:
Originally Posted by 05edge View Post
And I thought you could read...
Quote:
Originally Posted by 05edge View Post
although i will be keeping it "street legal" with the help of good friends being the ones doing the inspection, so i have that option
If your good friends are doing inspections what are you worried about?

Unless you aren't talking about state inspections
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 01-25-2013
05edge's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: campton/milan nh
Posts: 901
When did I ever say I was worried? Are you just trying to start arguments? Its a hell of a lot easier for me to plug my truck in then it is to wait for someone to come with their truck.

Moving on, does anyone know if its possible to trick my computer into thinking its working so I can use my truck instead of pluging someone elses in?
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 01-25-2013
01RangerEdge's Avatar
Scrambles the DeathDealer
iTrader: (11)
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Jackson, MO
Posts: 7,598
Quote:
Originally Posted by 05edge View Post
When did I ever say I was worried? Are you just trying to start arguments? Its a hell of a lot easier for me to plug my truck in then it is to wait for someone to come with their truck.

Moving on, does anyone know if its possible to trick my computer into thinking its working so I can use my truck instead of pluging someone elses in?
I guess I misunderstood your build.

I thought you were gutting the wiring harness and running a dedicated harness for the engine.

If you plan on using the stock cluster, harness, etc. Then it's a different story.

If you have friends doing state inspections then I wouldn't even bother trying to keep any of the stock wiring, running a dedicated harness would allow to correct power the engine and accessories easier since you are bypassing the maze of a stock harness that requires computers to tell it what to do and when to do it.

Not only that but adding accessories would be much easier since you can run higher quality wires for heavier draw.

I'm not going to be much help, I was just confused on why you would retain any of the stock harness.

Since I'm typing a reply and cannot see the thread are you going carb or EFI? EFI would make sense since you are asking questions about the stock harness and computer
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 01-25-2013
05edge's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: campton/milan nh
Posts: 901
Quote:
Originally Posted by 01RangerEdge View Post
I guess I misunderstood your build.

I thought you were gutting the wiring harness and running a dedicated harness for the engine.

If you plan on using the stock cluster, harness, etc. Then it's a different story.

If you have friends doing state inspections then I wouldn't even bother trying to keep any of the stock wiring, running a dedicated harness would allow to correct power the engine and accessories easier since you are bypassing the maze of a stock harness that requires computers to tell it what to do and when to do it.

Not only that but adding accessories would be much easier since you can run higher quality wires for heavier draw.

I'm not going to be much help, I was just confused on why you would retain any of the stock harness.

Since I'm typing a reply and cannot see the thread are you going carb or EFI? EFI would make sense since you are asking questions about the stock harness and computer
I'm going carb and the harness is coming out. I will be making my own with a gauge cluster. I didn't know if there was a way to run wires to the stock computer to run just enough information for inspection. I know that it monitors rpm while plugged into ob2 and its going to search for any codes I didn't know if I could trick the computer into thinking everything's fine. Probably not is what I'm thinking and if it is possible its probably not worth the hassle.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 01-27-2013
The SuperDookie Ranger's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
Posts: 817
Quote:
Originally Posted by 05edge View Post
I'm going carb and the harness is coming out. I will be making my own with a gauge cluster. I didn't know if there was a way to run wires to the stock computer to run just enough information for inspection. I know that it monitors rpm while plugged into ob2 and its going to search for any codes I didn't know if I could trick the computer into thinking everything's fine. Probably not is what I'm thinking and if it is possible its probably not worth the hassle.
In your case you would be a alot better off staying EFI, It's practically plug and play other than a few repinning at some connectors. Your 05 and you have newer gauges, which do work, On my 04 my tach and fuel level gauges work as well as all the indicator lights. I have no speedo so I don't know.
I can also still hook a scanner to my OBII port, I used an SCT to tune my truck for instance. Your looking at a lot more changes going carb than staying EFI, It's been done, but not sure why.
Not sure just what you wanna trick the computer on? My ECU has PATS delete, Auto transmission functions deleted(I have 5 speed), As well as a nice tune that I can adjust all my parameters and still read trouble codes. I couldn't imagine having going carb'd,
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 01-27-2013
05edge's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: campton/milan nh
Posts: 901
I'm actually a lot better off going carb. If I was to stay efi I would have to find a 94+ engine and I'm very limited on cam choices. Unless i spend the money to convert a older block to a roller cam, and what that costs its not worth the little gains, and I would be back to limited cam choices. And I need a computer to do any kind of tuning. Not to mention the extra money it takes to upgrade. I can buy a new carb for the price of injectors, and all I need is a screwdriver to tune. And when your at an event with very limited resources, simple is better. I don't see how I'm looking at more changes going carb.

I want new gauges. The stock cluster doesn't have enough information like the temp, ok im either hot or cold but what temp am i at? And I dont want other gauges mounted everywhere. I would need the computer to be tricked on everything, I don't think a stock ecu would help me pass if its reading nothing.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 01-27-2013
The SuperDookie Ranger's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
Posts: 817
Well it all depends on what you want personally or what's easier to work on for you. I don't know emission laws for where your at, but i'd say if you replace your engine with an older carb'd engine you won't have a chance in passing emissions. It usually has to be an engine from the same year or newer.
As far as gauges I agree about wanting to know exactly what is going on with your setup, you might as well pull the stock cluster and build your own using all the gauges you want. I just installed pillar gauges as well as gauges on the steering column(Oil Pressure, Oil Temp, ECT, Fuel Pressure) and a monster tach on the dash, they are definitely good to have and look cool.
Im an EFI guy, I'd much rather plug in a tuner and push a couple buttons to check codes or tune than use a screw driver, I do enough maintenance trying to keep the truck running.
The 351 swap is still new territory for 98+, I think a guy did a carb'd 351 in a 2000. There might be a link or something you can get info on. Would be cool to see you do it in an 05 carb or efi.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 01-27-2013
05edge's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: campton/milan nh
Posts: 901
Oh dont get me wrong, efi is very nice. But not in a mud truck that rarely sees tar, unless money isnt an issue. Think of spending $1500 on a nice fuel injection system. Now go throw it into a mud puddle. See where im coming from? And i doubt it would even work right after that. And you cant tell me that efi is easier to work on then a carb. Ya its easier to plug into and find out whats happening, but you still have to hunt down the problem with everything covered in mud. And you have to tear it all apart in a field with no electricity and the only tools you have are the ones you brought. I think ill stick with a carb when all you have to do is take it off, clean it out and your good to go.

yes we do have emissions, but like i said i wont be hooking my truck up to the state machine, ill be using another truck, so its not a problem. I will be pulling the old cluster out, and im going to build my own to put back into the same place. It should look real nice.

I know all about the ease of tuning with a computer/tuner. My car is a "tuner" and i have a program for my laptop where i can go into my ecu and change anything you can think of. Its actually the only way i can pass inspection. I dont have cats so i have to force all my not ready codes to ready. Its pretty trick. Hahaha you make it sound like twisting a couple adjuster screws is tough business.

I saw that 2000 ranger that has the 351w in it. There isnt much for information on the build. I tried getting a hold of him but nothing yet. And thank you, thats a big reason why im not doing a 302. A 351 in a 2005 has probably never been done before.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 01-29-2013
05edge's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: campton/milan nh
Posts: 901
So a little change in plans. Most people are going to be happy, im going EFI, as much as i dont want to. I found a parts truck i couldnt pass up. its a complete running ,early 90's f350 with a 351w, c6 tranny, np205 tcase, d60's for $800!
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 01-29-2013
99DangerRanger's Avatar
Level III Supporter
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: New Creek, WV
Posts: 441
You going to build the 60s and put them under there while you're at it?
Reply With Quote
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
351W random ?'s bmxrider11225 8-Cylinder Tech 10 06-30-2009 12:47 AM
351W Help pacepace87 8-Cylinder Tech 2 12-08-2008 01:39 PM
99 Ranger With a 351W TurboRangerFreak 8-Cylinder Tech 5 03-28-2008 05:13 PM
351w For Sale redranger_02 8-Cylinder Tech 8 01-19-2007 12:34 PM


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:46 PM.


We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.