'dog walkin' - Ranger-Forums - The Ultimate Ford Ranger Resource


Suspension Tech General discussion of suspension for the Ford Ranger.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #1  
Old 02-14-2011
ranger024x4's Avatar
RF Veteran
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: nova
Posts: 5,061
'dog walkin'

ok, this is random as ****. We are having an argument here at work and I want to see what you all think..

Its about 'dog walking'.. you know, sometimes you see the truck going down the road that isnt actually going straight and you can see the side of the truck? Bacailly, the argument is if you dont but the axle exactly on straight and the truck goes sideways, does it mess up your tires on the rear axle?

I dont think it will, because you are going to have to turn the steering wheel to make the truck track straight, so I dont think it really will hurt the tires.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 02-14-2011
RLong31's Avatar
The Ban Hammer
iTrader: (5)
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Monrovia, IN
Posts: 2,629
I disagree. I say it chews up tires. And thats with no valid argument or evidence to prove it.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 02-14-2011
dixie_boysles's Avatar
Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: NC
Posts: 3,778
its really putting a strain on all 4 if you ask me
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 02-14-2011
ranger4.0's Avatar
Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: cambridge, ontario
Posts: 3,922
your alignment is out. tires will suffer. period.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 02-14-2011
01RangerEdge's Avatar
Scrambles the DeathDealer
iTrader: (11)
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Jackson, MO
Posts: 7,598
How is this an argument? Of course it will eat tires
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 02-14-2011
ranger024x4's Avatar
RF Veteran
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: nova
Posts: 5,061
how though?

either way, the rear tires are still pointed straight. your steering wheel is now turned. I dont understand how it will eat the rear tires up.


I always think about the monster truck with 4 wheel steering, one way they turn opposite of each other and you will turn harder, but if you make them turn exactly the same, it will make the truck's body turn but still go straight down the road
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 02-14-2011
SteelDirigible's Avatar
Member
iTrader: (4)
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Lexington, KY
Posts: 3,666
let me throw a theory out there, because i deifnitely see both sides of it. even if they are tracking straight, with the body crooked, there will still be some sideways component to pull the wheels at a sideways angle.

or let me restate. the back wheels are pushing straight forward. the force goes forward, but is at an angle to the body, which pushes the truck to one side. perhaps i will make a diagram...
i think its more complicated than people think, but yes I believe it wears on the tires.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 02-14-2011
01RangerEdge's Avatar
Scrambles the DeathDealer
iTrader: (11)
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Jackson, MO
Posts: 7,598
I'm confused, is the axle perpendicular to the frame? If it isn't then you're going to eat your u joints because the driveshaft will turn on 2 axes.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 02-14-2011
ranger024x4's Avatar
RF Veteran
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: nova
Posts: 5,061
Quote:
Originally Posted by 01RangerEdge View Post
I'm confused, is the axle perpendicular to the frame? If it isn't then you're going to eat your u joints because the driveshaft will turn on 2 axes.
im talking about very minimal amount. the stuff you sometime see driving down the road. just enough that you can tell its not really going down straight.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 02-14-2011
Timberwolf's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: East coast Canada
Posts: 706
offset Toe angle?
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 02-14-2011
01RangerEdge's Avatar
Scrambles the DeathDealer
iTrader: (11)
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Jackson, MO
Posts: 7,598
If it's minimal and the rear tires are still going straight, then you won't do immediate damage, but it's something that should get fixed.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 02-14-2011
SteelDirigible's Avatar
Member
iTrader: (4)
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Lexington, KY
Posts: 3,666
ok here. I made a diagram. black shows the force forward from the rear tire. there is a component (orange) parallel to frame. regardless of which direction you turn the front wheels, there is an overall forward force parallel to frame. anytime the wheels are turned there is extra strain. which is why tires wear more when turning. so basically, and offset axle is like being able to put the stresses of a turn on your truck while going in a straight line.

Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 02-14-2011
Masteratarms93's Avatar
Member
iTrader: (8)
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Goose Creek SC
Posts: 4,685
That is actually something I was thinking about when I did my 8.8 swap.

Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 02-14-2011
ranger024x4's Avatar
RF Veteran
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: nova
Posts: 5,061
i can def see both sides. also didnt even think about the ujoints
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 02-14-2011
leadfoot's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: MA
Posts: 894
Quote:
Originally Posted by ranger024x4 View Post
i can def see both sides. also didnt even think about the ujoints
U-joints are never in perfect alignment so unless it is extreme I don't think it would matter.

Personally I think the rear tires would not wear any faster but I think that the front tires would wear faster from constantly turning.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 02-14-2011
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: WA
Posts: 27
long term your gonna have damage, and part of that damage is gonna be your tires
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 02-14-2011
buzzthedog's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Pawnee, illinois
Posts: 71
We have Ford E150 -250 vans at work and they all do this. Ford vans are well known to dog track. All of our vans have close to 400,000 miles on them and we have never really noticed any more wear on the tires than normal, they are rotated regularly.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 02-15-2011
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Lakewood, CO
Posts: 48
The way I remember this:

If you're aligned well (thrust angle) and have all tires running in the same direction (with steering at the wheel / rack / pitman = centered) then you'll be largely OK while traveling straight -- if you're "steering" to maintain the dog-tracking then you'll be introducing the Ackerman angle (that's the ratio that related the inside and outside steering of the front wheels the operating angle of the steering arms coupled with the angle to the tie-rods determine the differential steering applied to each wheel -- outside wheel travels in a wider arc when turning)...

Anyway -- if the thrust angle alignment is spot-on -- all should be right with the world for going straight, however, since the tie-rod and steering arm angles are affected (by aligning to address the dog-track) turns become a new devil and should likely result in accelerated front tire wear. The introduced Ackerman angles become non-symetrical about the "modified" centerline / direction of travel ... In the illustration above the "right" front steering would be more sensative to steering input, which may be fun for right turns but could 'push like hell' for a left turn...
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 03-03-2011
morris's Avatar
RF Veteran
iTrader: (5)
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: South Detroit.
Posts: 7,833
we have a couple buses at work that do this. i saw one the other day and it was bad. i was like WTF!?!?! a brand new hybrid dog walking...?
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 03-03-2011
3.0ranger1227's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: La Jolla, CA
Posts: 42
I agree that it will burn through 1 front tire quicker than the other because of the ackerman as stated above.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 03-08-2011
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: orange county, ca
Posts: 136
For most people with this issue, it wont cause uneven wear, some people who offroad or are rougher on their trucks may have more extreme conditions of course. Rangers have really squirrelly rear ends and over time, going over bumps hard, offroading and such, this dog walk will happen. I beleive the phenomenon of it happening over bumps and such is called thrust angle, thats how you measure the degree of the angle the rear is off by. (0 degrees is perfectly straight in front of one another)

. For example, my truck has a thrust angle of about 20 degrees, just from the design of the rear end and years of driving(i hardly ever am "off road") it exhibits this difference or "dog walk". my alignment is dead on, as is my tire wear and my steering wheel is dead center when i drive and it doesnt swurve or anything. the trucks axle is still perpendicular to the direction your driving, its just slightly diagonally shifted to one side.

i hope this helps, its kind of hard to articulate effectively, i would never be a good teacher lol.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 03-12-2011
Chris98's Avatar
Member
iTrader: (3)
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Thornton, CO
Posts: 705
We just covered this at school over the past 2 weeks. Basically you will not have wear issues on your rear tires, the rear axle will still go straight. You are going to turn the steering wheel to keep the truck going straight. And in result you will have feathering on your front tires. At first you are going to think you have a bad toe problem but the tell tale sign is that one tire will have feathering on the inner edge of the tire and the other tire will have feathering on the outer edge of the tire. Now if you only have feathering on one tire and the other tire is wearing normal, it means you have a toe issue on one tire and "Dog Tracking" issue in the rear. I don't have my books on me right now or I would scan the diagrams that shows all of this.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 03-12-2011
ranger024x4's Avatar
RF Veteran
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: nova
Posts: 5,061
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris98 View Post
We just covered this at school over the past 2 weeks. Basically you will not have wear issues on your rear tires, the rear axle will still go straight. You are going to turn the steering wheel to keep the truck going straight. And in result you will have feathering on your front tires. At first you are going to think you have a bad toe problem but the tell tale sign is that one tire will have feathering on the inner edge of the tire and the other tire will have feathering on the outer edge of the tire. Now if you only have feathering on one tire and the other tire is wearing normal, it means you have a toe issue on one tire and "Dog Tracking" issue in the rear. I don't have my books on me right now or I would scan the diagrams that shows all of this.
great info. thanks!
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 03-16-2011
94powerranger's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: AMELIA OH
Posts: 112
i go to a technical school and im a mechanic/technician at pep boys. dog tracking will cause tire wear. its like being out of adjustment on your toe in the frot end. the tires are angled and are forced to go straight. which will give them a feathered wear pattern.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
hauling the dog klc317 Interior Semi-Tech 16 12-21-2006 05:52 PM
dog puked in my truck firstranger Auto Detailing 101 17 05-19-2006 07:35 PM
Let's see everyone's dog mod! fx4me General Ford Ranger Discussion 38 10-17-2005 01:31 PM


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:58 PM.


We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.