I just installed a " non - self adjusting clutch " . Now I cannot shift when the engine is running even though my slave and master are 100% bled and hard as a rock .

A member here previously stated in 2013 to "not" use a non self adjusting clutch if your truck came with a self adjusting clutch. I concur , even though he is the only person out of 100 different posts I read that even mentions problems. it's strange , as my 2000 F150 w the 4.2 and the Mazda R50D 5 speed worked fine and I was just installing a new clutch as it has 126,000 miles and I just bought a camper , so it was preventive maintenance and it was due : I put in the NON self adjusting and had 1 inch of pedal travel to engage : no biggy, BUT , it drags slightly , really noticeable in reverse, and more importantly, I can no longer shift when the truck is running .

The shifter was installed correctly with the two round buttons and the slot all aligned and in neutral: the master cylinder was bench bled , (3 times ) , the slave gravity bled x 1 quart of brake fluid through clear plastic tubing held under the fluid ( no bubbles and pedal hard as a rock) . I have 5/16th inch throw out bearing movement which I believe is what it should be . I also inspected my pedal hangers for wear or breaks: all is good there .

I am 99% positive using a NON self adjusting clutch has caused my problems.... I will see this week when it all gets taken apart AGAIN! Anyone else had this happen ? They sell both " NON self adjusting clutch" and "Self adjusting clutch " kits for Rangers and F150's using the R50D transmission , why would they do this if there are inherent problems with the NON self adjusting clutch ???

 

It will get better as you drive it and the clutch disc gets worn down a bit, so not a permanent issue

Did you get the non-SAC(self adjusting clutch) pressure plate with the clutch disc in a kit?
Or were they separate?

The SAC disc is usually a bit thicker to last longer but when that's paired with a non-SAC pressure plate you get what you have now

SAC pressure plate can be moved farther away from flywheel when new(compressed), so a thicker clutch disc can be used

Your problem now is when you press down the clutch pedal all the way the pressure plate is not moving back far enough so clutch disc is rubbing on flywheel and pressure plate, so can't slow down and stop turning to match transmission speed, which is 0 RPMs when vehicle is stopped
So you can't get transmission into gear until clutch disc is at 0 RPMs, in this case engine off, so flywheel and pressure plate are at 0 RPMs as well

In the past the slave was on the outside of the bell housing and when a new clutch disc was installed you would adjust the push rod on slave to move pressure plate back more to release clutch disc, then you would adjust it as the clutch disc got thinner as it wore out and started slipping, until there was no more adjustment and new disc was needed

With internal slaves no such adjustment is possible, so ALL internal slave clutches should use SAC regardless of what they came with from the factory, they adjust each time you press the clutch pedal down all the way
Not that that helps you now, lol

Anyway just drive it and feather the clutch and try to get clutch disc worn down over the next 2 weeks and you should be fine after that

 

Hi Ron.... Appreciate the reply. What you said was exactly what my dad and I were thinking ...he is 85 and I am 59 and between us we have a lot of years working on stuff and have never had this problem with a clutch. As far as the thickness of the disc, I bought them from Ebay a couple of years ago because the price was good ...probably mismatched ??? So much for a bargain! I'm done with it .... took it over to my friend who has a repair shop and used to work for Ford, he said the pedal was great , no air in the lines ,master, slave and he said probably was being caused by the non-adjustable clutch. I can't really wait for it to wear as It will be pretty hard driving around town in second gear all the time for 2 weeks and freeways will be totally out of the question , and I may still be in the same boat 2 weeks from now .

Unfortunately my friend had a stroke 2 years ago and his "Heavy repair" guy is out , so he can't do it , but he recommended a shop and they will do it for $900 with a LUK self adjusting clutch and pressure plate. As I blew out the seals in my dad's 1969 ton and a quarter jack and the 3 ton leaks , and the old motorcycle jack doesn't make it easy to get a transmission in , I'm just going to shell out the money . At 59 with a 5 year old son and two 85 year old parents, one in a convalescent hospital going on 3 years, I have a lot on my plate . This was fine doing it once over three days , but I hurt like hell . In the "old days" I had lots of friends who would be over in a heartbeat to help out but as happens in life , they are all moved away , have their own issues in life , etc , etc , etc ...........

Thanks so much for your input .... stay well !

 

You could just let it idle with clutch pedal down in 1st, it will wear down fairly fast that way, although you do have to sit in the truck for awhile, lol

Just to confirm, you can put the trans in 1st with engine off, and then start the engine with foot on the clutch and brake pedals and the engine will idle, just wants to creep forward?
And there is NO Noise?
i.e. bad pilot bearing, which can cause similar symptom

Pilot bearing allows the input shaft/clutch disc to slow down to 0 RPMs while flywheel is at 700 RPMs(engine idle)

 

Yeap! Exactly as you say ! Not a noise or grind , quiet as a Toyota Prius sneaking up on your rear in a Costco parking lot ! The only thing I would hate to do is trash my new flywheel ! I will let you know how it goes when i get it replaced, found a shop with a good reputation, my normal go to guy from High school had a stroke two years ago and his heavy equipment guy is swamped his scheduler said (Damn, I am repeating myself....early onset of Dementia ???lol, hope not .... this other guy helped him out a lot when he had his stroke so he seems like a good guy....the weird thing is , he is a young guy who has been doing this as a professional for 12 years and had no idea what I was talking about when I referred to the clutch that ratchets as a "self adjusting clutch"...... I schooled him on the mysteries of such, but it seemed like he thought I was crazy at first ...doesn't instill a huge amount of confidence , but as he was recommended and doesn't have much of any bad feedback, I will go with him , LUK clutch pressure plate and disc, self adjusting , $900 installed . My Dad actually had good luck getting his Buick Automatic transmission done at our local "AAMCO" , and previous to that a Ford Ranger , I would rip it out again myself but I'm pretty much on overload all the time and hurt like hell ...damn arthritis ! I ordered a kit for the1969 Floor jack, but a floor jack is not a transmission jack and I was lucky the first time I stabbed it in first shot and didn't drop it on my face .... I used the ratcheting straps to get it up high enough then raised it the rest of the way with the leaky 3 ton jack and my old Motorcycle jack.... it was quite the swear fest , especially when the 50 year old PROTO ratchet fell off the extension stack and wacked me in the chin..... My dad has a lot of tools all good , most old , I have the second biggest top and bottom box they sell at harbor freight with a lifetime of Craftsman tools , but I live in a mobile home park and even though I have lived here since 1986, they still like to send nasty notes if they "Catch You" breakin' the law !

 

Just an update for those who have the same problem , it was definitely the Non-self adjusting clutch that cause the problem , they put in a LUK self adjusting clutch and a 4 spring LUK disc.... shifts like butter ! That said , the 5 spring disc I had probably would have worked with just a new pressure plate, but I did not want to chance it . It is possible they sent me a clutch and disc for an older model originally , but not likely. I noticed a 1/8 inch difference in the height of the spline on the disc , and at least 1/4 of an inch difference in the height of the original clutch compared to the new non adjustable clutch . Definitely will never substitute a non-adjusting clutch for an adjustable again.

 

Thanks for the update and THE FIX

 

Glad to share my experience , I hope it saves someone from the same problem I had . A Ranger and a F150 are so similar , I can see it happening easily . My last Ranger was a 1984, my Dad had a 1999, great trucks ...... I have a 2002 Explorer, the 2000 F150, and a 1997 Expedition in the Philippines which is a constant pain in the Butt: It's in real decent shape but the heat and humidity screw with the brakes , the fuel has made me replace the fuel pump twice , and hard to get part for there. My dad had a 2005 F150 , the 5.4 L ( I think) with the Cam Phasers and that was an absolute pile of garbage ....finally fixed it and sold it after the dealer said they would not fix it and they would only put in a crate motor. Independent garage wanted $2500, said they had to disassemble the cams: You don't have to . lock them in place with 2 vice grips on either side at TDC. We fixed it and he traded it in towards a GMC.