Panhard setup. - Ranger-Forums - The Ultimate Ford Ranger Resource


Project Logs For detailed builds specific to the Ford Ranger, one thread per vehicle please.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #1  
Old 10-15-2008
D.
Unregistered User
 
Posts: n/a
Panhard setup.

I posted some pics in the pictures thread, figured I would put it all together here.

A big problem with a lot of cars/trucks being built for the street/strip is keeping the wheels under the vehicle. Have you ever seen a burnout mark on a road and it looks all squiggly like an ' S '? Its due to the weight and movement above the tires not distributing properly. This causes uneven traction and one tire grabbing harder then the other. Keeping the weight ( body ) solid above both tires helps a lot. Sway bars are great, but they are more for roll then keeping things centered.

A lot of 4x4 trucks use a panhard type of setup but I believe they might call it something different ( draglink? ). My terms are limited on offroad entities as I really haven't gone Haywire like Beard and others have in their quests for ultimate lifts and such. I like my truck on the ground and launching quick.

The theory is the same in both applications.

Frame mount.


One side of the bar needs to be tied to the frame in some way and the other to the axle. I put a plate on the frame here ( over the winter ) and reenforced it recently.

Frame bracket :


This is where one end of the bar will mount.

Axle bracket :
Name:  tab1.jpg
Views: 9
Size:  152.8 KB

Name:  tab2.jpg
Views: 8
Size:  235.9 KB

Mount welded to the axle. Not seen ion the picture are the 2 right-triangle gussets I added for strength.
Name:  s1.jpg
Views: 8
Size:  94.4 KB

I added a 3/4th's inch cross brace. I will add one across the top when I have someone here to help take the bed off so I can get in with the welder.



This is the Bar itself. Its adjustable in length by 5 inches. Has grease fittings on both ends .

Name:  s3.jpg
Views: 8
Size:  117.9 KB

Assembled but still needing that top ' cross-brace '


Even without the brace on top, I decided to go launch on it. The results were AWESOME. Launched perfectly straight!

Once the top brace is on and I have it all bracketed in, I plan on doing some drifting to see if it helps in slides or negates it. I think it will help as it will take the dampening of lateral movement from the leaf springs out of the equation as the leafs no longer have any side-to-side movement at all, just vertical.

I now should have the time to take apart the front end , add in ' Mother ' and put the coil setup in.

Lookin for 10's with this truck. Probably in the spring.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 10-15-2008
rangerboy101's Avatar
RF Veteran
iTrader: (5)
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Winchester, Va
Posts: 8,187
i hate you sometimes.... lol. jk. looks good.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 10-15-2008
CJGSAY's Avatar
Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Up North, MN
Posts: 426
That looks fantastic, nice work
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 10-15-2008
D.
Unregistered User
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by rangerboy101 View Post
i hate you sometimes.... lol. jk. looks good.
Don't hate me.. try and catch me
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 10-15-2008
trucks423's Avatar
Member
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 687
'mother'?
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 10-15-2008
Toreador4x4's Avatar
Member
iTrader: (6)
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Livonia, MI
Posts: 3,958
Like Frank Zappa and the Mothers, I was just telling Zach the other day that D. reminds me of Frank Zappa
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 10-15-2008
Rooks's Avatar
Member
iTrader: (7)
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Posts: 1,867
10s? Damn D., your truck must just fly. Want the hell you pushing right now down the 1/4, and what is going to push you the 10s range?

Bar looks like a damn good idea.... but I'm kind of curious why you used the angle iron to lower it to make it level with the axle? Wouldn't simply making a mount near the frame rail do the same functional thing, and have a lot less likely hood of breaking? I'm mean the link wouldn't be parallel like yours, but at the same time, you wouldn't have pressure on a big piece of angle like yours? Not saying yours will break as it looks beefy as hell, just curious if there was logic behind it is all.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 10-15-2008
Fx4wannabe01's Avatar
RF Veteran
iTrader: (23)
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Boring, Oregon
Posts: 21,721
yuck! boogers! lol.


D...i will ride in this thing someday i swear.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 10-15-2008
99ranger4x4's Avatar
RF Veteran
iTrader: (3)
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 12,198
I'll help ya out here, the drag link is for steering on real suspension setups it goes from the pitman arm down to the tie-rod or passenger side knuckle


your looking for "track bar" Its used to locate the axle laterally when your running a 3 link or non-triangulated 4-link. I've seen it used before with leaf springs on off road trucks(mainly monstrous show trucks) but without it you get more travel, and it should be as close as you can get it to the same angle and length as the drag link.



Anyways, keep it comin', nice work man.

Last edited by 99ranger4x4; 10-15-2008 at 11:10 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 10-15-2008
99ranger4x4's Avatar
RF Veteran
iTrader: (3)
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 12,198
Quote:
Originally Posted by SniperX103 View Post
10s? Damn D., your truck must just fly. Want the hell you pushing right now down the 1/4, and what is going to push you the 10s range?

Bar looks like a damn good idea.... but I'm kind of curious why you used the angle iron to lower it to make it level with the axle? Wouldn't simply making a mount near the frame rail do the same functional thing, and have a lot less likely hood of breaking? I'm mean the link wouldn't be parallel like yours, but at the same time, you wouldn't have pressure on a big piece of angle like yours? Not saying yours will break as it looks beefy as hell, just curious if there was logic behind it is all.

the closer to level it is the better it functions(correct?), if thats what you mean.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 10-16-2008
Dangerranger01's Avatar
Member
iTrader: (6)
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Boring/Corvallis, Oregon
Posts: 2,011
^^ True. the axle moves left and right, and with D's set up, the bar takes all the force. If it were angled, you'd get some force in the up and down axis. Just doesn't work as good that way, but it'd work.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 10-16-2008
D.
Unregistered User
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by SniperX103 View Post
10s? Damn D., your truck must just fly. Want the hell you pushing right now down the 1/4, and what is going to push you the 10s range?
Quarter times presently.. Dunno. I have 8th mile times though as thats what our local track is.

Whats going to push it? A different motor.

Quote:
Bar looks like a damn good idea.... but I'm kind of curious why you used the angle iron to lower it to make it level with the axle? Wouldn't simply making a mount near the frame rail do the same functional thing, and have a lot less likely hood of breaking? I'm mean the link wouldn't be parallel like yours, but at the same time, you wouldn't have pressure on a big piece of angle like yours?
The bar needs to be parallel to the axle. If its not, your going to have a lean when you launch and go either left or right. The angle iron nwill be closed off by the time I'm done. I have to finish a few things and needed to get the bed off. I did what I could on my own but needed someone else over here to help get the bed off.

It rained tonight so.. I have to see how dry it is tomorrow so I can finish welding in the bracing and such.

Quote:
Not saying yours will break as it looks beefy as hell, just curious if there was logic behind it is all.
I CAN break that setup. Honestly.. I've broke 2 similar setups already. When I'm done boxing everything it.. It will be pretty much bullet proof.

Last edited by D.; 10-16-2008 at 05:27 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 10-16-2008
D.
Unregistered User
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by 99ranger4x4 View Post
I'll help ya out here, the drag link is for steering on real suspension setups it goes from the pitman arm down to the tie-rod or passenger side knuckle

your looking for "track bar" Its used to locate the axle laterally when your running a 3 link or non-triangulated 4-link. I've seen it used before with leaf springs on off road trucks(mainly monstrous show trucks) but without it you get more travel, and it should be as close as you can get it to the same angle and length as the drag link.

Anyways, keep it comin', nice work man.
Thank you! I didn't know all the terms for it. I could probably assemble it all with a pile of parts, but don't know all the names.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 10-16-2008
korey89's Avatar
Member
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: South, FL
Posts: 4,672
Why Panhard instead of a Watt's link?
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 10-16-2008
99MazdaB4000's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Kutztown, PA
Posts: 1,980
Looks good D.!
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 10-16-2008
D.
Unregistered User
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by korey89 View Post
Why Panhard instead of a Watt's link?
1000-1500$ to buy a kit that wasn't designed for a ranger and modify it to fit. Worry about off-center balancing, more moving parts, more complexity, finding room to fit all those ' extra parts '.. OR.. spend less then 100$ of my own cash ( really.. all of about 25$ ) and make my own setup thats just as effective for what I want to do and have the glorious aspect of saying ' I made my own '. Where is that exhaust system going to run again? I cut my tailpipes off to make room for welding on mine. I need to re-make them to clear a whole lot better. With a Watts-link.. forget it! You have a high perch to clear!



I'll take the later. Simplicity and Ease to fabricate.

The gossip about a watts-link -->

"Unlike a panhard bar system that constrain the axle motion to an arc during jounce and rebound, the watts link allows the axle to move in a true vertical plane. The end result is a more tuneable and predictable vehicle on all road and track surfaces."

A watts-link does NOT allow for individual wheel travel unlike a panhard setup. I still drive over curbs and rough roads. I have a truck. With a wattslink, when one tire goes up, the other does not. when one tire is pushed in laterally to the leaf, the other is pulled upon.. If the tire being pulled on has the grip ( as the other tire is up ), what happens to all your torque?

A panhard uses 2 pivoting points, A watts-link has 1 that is centered.

I believe I would bust a watts-link on the streets.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 10-16-2008
TRoyBv6320's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Olathe, KS
Posts: 220
Maybe I don't understand, which is probably the case, but if the entire axle wants to move up or down, wouldn't that bar pull it the the passenger side? If only one side goes down, it will pivot, and it will be fine, but it's a solid bar, it has a radius.

Maybe that's the point? You don't want it to move? Would that work? I'm going to have to do some research on this now, I hate it when I don't know how things work.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 10-16-2008
TRoyBv6320's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Olathe, KS
Posts: 220
I think your last post just answered my question, but I still don't understand how it helps traction that much.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 10-16-2008
D.
Unregistered User
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRoyBv6320 View Post
I think your last post just answered my question, but I still don't understand how it helps traction that much.
You have tires. They are on the ground. They have weight suspended above them. The force of the load is pushing down on them evenly.

If the axle moves below that load to either the left or right, the weight distribution across the tires is now unbalanced. One tire will carry a lighter load.

A factor as well, being on leaf springs that have bushings and shackles.. Once that load moves from its original position, it will then have to move back. This ' swaying ' motion will then change the load to the other side of the vehicle. The motion will continue until something stops it.

Wide tires ( I run a 255 series with soft compound/silica ) will help and give a good contact surface. If the weight isn't distributed properly, having all that surface will HELP, but still not have the full effect.

Theres a term for it.. ( Damn.. I forgot what it was! ) Offhand I can't remember what it is. Chris ( Gumby ) or Rich might know what its called.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 10-16-2008
BurningRANGERtires's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: North Sin City, NV
Posts: 312
hey sorry for being a little off topic but those are lakewood traction bars correct?? when i connect mine it drops my truck an inch or more just to connect the bolts.. did you use longer bolts on your set up??
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 10-16-2008
TRoyBv6320's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Olathe, KS
Posts: 220
I get it now, I just didn't realize it would help that much, on the other hand, I don't race either.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 10-16-2008
sniper_101's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Sask, Canada
Posts: 1,902
Looks like a nice setup. Also thank you for explain how it works/comparison to Watts.

Is there a minimum length the Panhard Bar has to be to work properly/efficiently?

Does this also work with AOL (Axle over leaf [fliped axle]) setups?

Is it recommended that you run it with traction bars? I'm not sure if axle twist (without traction bars) would hurt the panhard setup or not . . .

Also, do you have a pinion seal leak or is that just me?

Thanks again, your truck gets better by the post!
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 10-16-2008
leadfoot's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: MA
Posts: 894
D. are you going to switch to a four-link rear suspension?
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 10-16-2008
D.
Unregistered User
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by BurningRANGERtires View Post
hey sorry for being a little off topic but those are lakewood traction bars correct?? when i connect mine it drops my truck an inch or more just to connect the bolts.. did you use longer bolts on your set up??
Actually.. I had to use a plasma cutter and trim the insides to fit my Disc brakes and wider wheels.

Longer bolts.. No. I had a local company make me a set of leafs ( Brute Spring ) that were lower ( less arch ) and stiffer ( higher rating then factory ). The bars bolted straight on. I have to use a couple of the thinner shims though for the rubber stoppers side so I can keep the quarter inch gap by the front spring pearches.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 10-16-2008
D.
Unregistered User
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ranger_Danger View Post
Looks like a nice setup. Also thank you for explain how it works/comparison to Watts.
Your welcome.

Quote:
Is there a minimum length the Panhard Bar has to be to work properly/efficiently?
The rod length will be different for EVERY vehicle. Even though we both have rangers, mine would not fit on yours ( Thats sounds really ' funny ' ). The rod itself is adjustable in length.

Quote:
Does this also work with AOL (Axle over leaf [fliped axle]) setups?
Yep. Same theory.

Quote:
Is it recommended that you run it with traction bars? I'm not sure if axle twist (without traction bars) would hurt the panhard setup or not . . .
I wouldn't run it without the traction bars. Do it all or do nothing.

[quote]Also, do you have a pinion seal leak or is that just me?[quote]

Thats junk/cleaning crap.

Quote:
Thanks again, your truck gets better by the post!
Your welcome and thank you!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What's your audio setup? Lone_Ranger01 Audio & Video Tech 83 06-03-2015 11:23 PM
panhard test (MUD) comunistico Snapshots 13 11-11-2011 05:22 AM
panhard bar (help hops while driving? ) comunistico Solid Axle Swaps 2 06-22-2011 05:37 PM
more front 3 link with a panhard questions... zabeard Suspension Tech 13 08-06-2008 01:42 PM
My setup... Mnemonic Audio & Video Tech 3 06-06-2004 12:23 AM


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:55 AM.


We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.