End of a long day. What I've done is install a quality rebuilt long block 2.9 in my 86 Ranger. I have many new parts installed shortly before I took on this project, including MAP sensor, EGR valve, Fuel pump, fuel filter, air filter. I've added a new water pump, power steering pump, hoses... a radiator coming. Not much left. Oh yes, I've replaced the fuel pump relay and connector, rebuilt the fuel injectors, cleaned the eec connector. I've even got a new computer somewhere that I can't find. All this and no start. A few hits.

I've made sure the base timing was right. I've rotated the distributor 180 degrees to see if that's good. I've pulled a plug and got spark. The fuel rail valve squirts gas, haven't done a pressure test. Mysteriously, the plugs seemed dry. Sprayed some starting fluid into the throttle body. Got some noise, but nothing close to a "catch" that indicates starting.

I'll wake up early and check the threads for diagnosing the injectors and EFI connections, but I am beat and just wanted to put this out there for the old pros who might have other thoughts.

Thanks in advance.

tony

 

Keep spraying the fuel into the intake, the 50/50 test while trouble shooting

The TFI spark system is autonomous, doesn't need the EEC to start engine, if it has fuel, so that's where to focus your attention
get it to start by adding fuel to the intake

Then you can move on to fuel system

Do you have a Grey TFI module or Black TFI module, it matters?

Info here: http://www.myo-p.com/Ford-EEC/EEC%20..._or_black.html

Pin 4 is the difference
You Should have a grey TFI module in an 1986

 

Okay, Ron and thanks as always.

I took a nap after dinner and am reading through your reply.

Yes, you are right about the color of the module. I know that module is gray as I ALSO have a new distributor with that color module. Getting that distributor and module was part of the process of getting the engine I replaced to run. When I pulled the distributor in that adventure I saw that I had two chipped gears, and the O'Reilly people gave me a new/rebuilt distributor.

By 50/50, you're saying to concentrate on spark and move on to fuel after that? Assuming that's the case, I will wake up tomorrow and look at that connector.

I've read the link you kindly provided. Provided insight into what kind of system I have, and that pin 4 is important, and a 22K resistor is involved.
It seems that I am having the issue I had before I installed this engine. The old engine did have cracked heads and compressions issues on the passenger side bank, so I felt sure that was where my starting problem was. All that said, what should I do about this pin 4 and moving forward?

When I left the job (off-site garage), I set a trickle charge on the battery. When I get up in the morning I'll use more starting fluid in the throttle body and inspect the connector that goes into the module, checking for clean connections. Also, will keep my phone handy to see if you have a suggestion for the next step.


Thanks so much,

tony

 

What Ron wants to know is will it fire and run while you spray starting fluid, it's a yes or no answer, depending on the answer he will guide you in the correct direction.

 

Okay. I will go in that direction. I can report that with the coil lead to the distributor off, the coil sparked like one of this gizmos in Frankenstein and I had an extra plug and did get spark when I cranked. But I'll crank and spray starter fluid in the throttle body.

Thanks for adding to the thread!

tony

 

Today's efforts include: I rechecked the base timing. Number one cylinder did blow air at the correct timing mark. Had the distributor module tested, was okay. Used electrical cleaner on the wires and the module connector. Looked good. Cranked the engine and used an indicator between plug and wire that revealed spark was good. Sprayed starter fluid in throttle body--pretty much nothing except for a few blips. Pulled two plugs and they smelled like ether. Wet, somewhat.
Just don't know. Never had an engine do this. With spark, and even with some lousy timing, I've got something to happen. Taking an hour to let the battery charge and read the Haynes book.

Thanks for any suggestions in advance,

tony

 

Also wanted to add that I found one of Ron's past posts on the 50/50 test. Great stuff there. Since I have spark, and a no start situation, I lean toward compression. Regarding base timing: when I got this engine the two marks for the cam and crank gears were aligned together and the keyway was up.

tony

 

Yes, that is odd Ether has a low ignition point so even minimal compression should get to fire/ignite

Yes, 50/50 test is simple and an easy way to determine where to start looking when there is a Crank but no start

Spark OR compression can be the problem when an engine doesn't fire with ether added

There are only two places the distributor rotor can be when crank is at TDC on the 2.9l, #1 or #5
Image here: https://therangerstation.com/tech_li...iringorder.gif

Distributor rotates clockwise

If it doesn't fire first time then pull distributor up and rotate rotor 180deg and put it back down, don't need to retime it as long as its a true 180deg
But you said you did that

So Compression must be the issue

Timing gears have their marks facing each other like most OHV setups, crank gear mark at 12:00, Cam gear mark at 6:00

 

Ron, thanks for hanging with me. Yes, your cam and crank alignment is what was happening before I slapped on the cover.

I'd checked compression in 1 4... and 5. Since I've been working in the cold, and compression was my concern, I wanted to make sure that there was good compression as I might've been off on adjusting the valves. But I'd checked it twice and do feel good about it.
Now, here's the deal:
I got it to fire up today. Can't say what did it. Nothing much different than what I'd done before. It's not idling, so I'm not sure if the injectors are getting all of the gas they should... or, the battery was pretty low and maybe there wasn't enough good juice to provide spark and fire the injectors. But it's looking like there's hope.
I've got the battery on trickle charge tonight, and will hit it tomorrow. Thinking that maybe the fuel pressure regulator might've been letting the fuel rail not reach its max???? Dunno. If you have any suggestions, I will listen, as always.

And again, thanks for being there.

tony

 

Turn key on, count to 3, then turn off, 4 times, that should build fuel pressure up to 30psi at the engine
Then check if fuel rail has pressure
If not then could be FPR leaking, but could also be Check Valve in the High Pressure Pump, it has a one-way valve to hold pressure in the system when engine is off

But...........if engine stays running at 1,500rpm but doesn't idle then that can't be a fuel pressure issue, because you need more fuel at 1,500rpm than 700rpm

Alternator needs to have engine RPMs at 600-700 to produce 13.5volts which is the minimum voltage of a running vehicle
Battery is only used to start the engine and then alternator takes over ALL electrical amps, which is why its set at 13.5v minimum, battery max voltage is 12.8v maybe 13.0v Brand new
So once engine starts voltage flows TO the battery from alternator to keep it charged for the next Startup
But battery can run all vehicle systems for 4 or 5 hours if alternator dies while driving, shorter time if head lights are on

 

Thanks Ron, I'll run with that program.

I did put in a new main fuel pump and filter back in late October, (when I was thinking of keeping the old engine going). Don't see a gas leak around FPR, so by "leaking" do I consider that there's a breach in that diaphragm? I'll see if there's a thread that details an FPR test. I do have a mighty-vac, so I can put some vacuum on it.

Did check threads and saw a post you (Ron) answered very concisely back in December: There doesn't seem to be gas in vacuum line of FPR when I was re-doing distributor yesterday (had to remove that line). Also, took note of the computer and capacitor issue. I do have an EEC that I bought from Amazon a few months ago... A Cardone for my year and the Federal Emissions standards, (which mine is). Maybe I should give that a go today?

As always, Much Appreciated.

Going to start early today; will report progress later.

Tony

 

Today's activity in our 42 degree heat wave...

Found that number 3 cylinder had low compression. My ear told me something was happening on that bank. Readjusted valves (made marks on distributor to indicate firing positions), and restored compression. That took a while.

Put in new plugs, and took fuel pressure reading. Seems the dial will go to 15 pounds psi, then wind down quickly. Not good. FPR shows no gas in the vacuum line. Mighty vac vaccum holds when I apply it to the FPR vacuum nipple.

No long term idle, but the engine will do a quick fire and sounds better (probably because of the valve readjustment). Come to the conclusion, obviously, that I've got the fuel issue happening. The plugs don't look wet, the engine seems like it's starving for gas... Here's what I've replaced in the fuel system: rebuilt the injectors. Napa chassis rail fuel pump was done in October, as was fuel filter. I'm beat up, but still in the game. My plan for tomorrow, before I run and buy a $50 FPR from Auto Zone, is check the lines. Any suggestions, or explanation of how this system works with feed/return is appreciated.

Thanks so much! Blessings to you all and I hope there are some people learning from this.

Tony

 

If you are careful you can pinch the Fuel return line coming out of the FPR, you can use vise grips but put on wider clamp surfaces so you don't wreck the hose

This is effect takes FPR out of the pressure question.

You can turn on the fuel pump full time with engine off using a jumper at the ODB-1 port(VIP port)

Look here: https://therangerstation.com/tech_library/OBD_I.shtml

Second drawing shows slots in ODB1 port, Fuel Pump slot is labelled, that slot is the GROUND for the fuel pump relay
So it you put a jumper wire in that slot and ground the other end fuel pump will come on when key is on, and go off when key is off
Makes testing fuel pressure easier

This OBD1 port should be on passenger side of engine bay by heater motor part of main wiring harness
It can have a plastic cap on it, with letters EEC

 

Thanks so much, Ron. I'll go in that direction this morning.

Yes, I found that connector port back in October, was buried between the heater fan and the air cleaner box. Shaped like a house.

Tony

 

I'm deeper into the Twilight Zone. Did replace the FPR. Didn't make a difference for the starting. Still hits. Last pressure check seemed to read that it pumped up to 18 psa, held, and bled down very slowly. (might be cheapo Harbor Freight kit). Earlier I'd taken a pressure test at on the fuel pump I'd installed back in October. With that it was fuel hose and clamps to the gauge, not the cheap brass fittings, and seemed to hang well around 80-90 psi. I also checked the fuel filter I'd installed at that time. Not plugged.

So, in working to check for return line leaks I took my old FPR plugged it with hose and a bolt, and installed it on the rail. Turned the key, and it shot up to 90, then slowly bled down to 60 psi.

At one point I used this Gerry-rigged FPR and clamped off the main fuel feed line to see if there was an indication that the injectors are bleeding... don't remember the number. Nothing much stays consistent or maybe I'm just doing the same thing too many times.

Went under and looked for leaks in the return line--saw none.

Also, seems that one bank (driver's side) has less signs of firing than the passenger side.

So, I'm beat and kinda lost here. I do have a new computer that I can install tomorrow in case there is a misfire issue in the old one. Or maybe it's injectors... or maybe I'm not doing the fuel pressure test right.

Help!

tony

 

Test pressure gauge on a tire, same schrader valve, and same pressure, 30-35psi
1996 to 1997 Ranger all ran with 30-35psi fuel pressure
If you get over 60psi then there is a major issue in the system, or with the gauge

1998 and up used 55psi returnless system, only 1 fuel line

If possible watch the rotor in the distributor spin while cranking the engine, I had a bad distributor shaft that "felt OK" when I had it out, but had a wobble, a Chevy V8, that was one pain in the butt to track down

 

Thanks Ron. The 60 psi was on a test when the return line was blocked. The psi was first at 90 or so, then bled down slowly to 60.

The FPR has been replaced. Testing at the fuel pump shows that it's putting out good. Oh, I've watched that distributor. No wobble. This engine is acting like it's not getting enough gas.

Today's plan is to replace computer.

Remove fuel rail, turn on the key and see if there's a stuck injector. After that, I don't know what's left.

tony

 

After re-doing a few tests, I decided to remove fuel rail. Turned key on, and ran fuel pump by using jumper wire to diagnostic port ground.

Number two cylinder fuel injector poured gas. Not the cylinder I would've figured. Had to decide on buying a set or checking local auto parts.

I have a few more questions, but will see if the pics I took are any help to anybody and will add to the thread later. The oil doesn't smell like gas. I have high zinc oil in there now. Should I absolutely replace it for my break in... or drain it and see what it looks like? Buy some new oil and ignore my wife's rants about the money I waste???

Thanks Ron.

tony

 

Here is the latest: No good news.

I did have a stuck fuel injector, flooded the oil with gas. Changed the oil, replaced injectors.

After I replaced the injectors, I noticed a wet valley in the intake manifold; discovered my fuel rail was leaking. Got lucky at the junkyard and found a fuel rail. I replaced the line from the fuel filter to the rail with injector line; the plastic had failed. New fuel filter. Everything went in nicely today.

Truck will hit for about three seconds, but no long term idle. After all this, I've got 10 lbs fuel pressure after two prime runs at the key.

I'm stuck. Please help if you've got a suggestion.

 

It should start and idle OK with 10psi, so does it drop after startup?

Like pump is shutting off

Have you tried using the Ground jumper on the OBD1 port in engine bay, that turns on fuel pump full time with key on?
Post #13 above

 

Thanks, Ron.
...
It drops. I did the fuel pump jumper trick at the diagnostic, but that was during the earlier phase (before I replaced injectors and rail). While I was beat and waiting for the battery to charge I did replace the computer...

tony

 

I am picking up the project again today, but first, here is more of the history of this truck.

About a month or two before it failed... and the fail was that I was going around fifty mph and the truck suddenly went to half-speed. Felt as if it became a three cylinder. Well, the month prior to this I'd experienced this in a "surge" fashion, in that it did reduce rpms, but it only lasted for a few seconds and corrected itself. I figured I needed the main rail fuel pump replaced.

And then I didn't get the chance to do that when the truck failed. I replaced that fuel pump, checked and replaced fuel pump relay and some sensors. No luck. I had no time, as we were busy with our pet sitting business, so I had AAA tow it to a shop. They discovered that I had cracked heads, low compression between number 2 and 3 cylinders, said I needed a new engine and they had no room to do that. Here in Reno, there were no takers when I called around. So, I found a quality long block and started the project. It got colder here, and that slowed me down.

As of now I am certain that it is a fuel issue, but all the numbers are scrambled in my head. I thought I'd beaten this when I found a stuck injector that flooded number 2 cylinder, and ruined my oil. Then I found a leaking fuel rail and replaced that with one at the junkyard. The truck wants to start, will give me lots of hits and a second or two of run, but no long term idle.

With Ron's kind help, and reading some of the past threads on fuel issues, I've learned a lot about this system. Long story short: today I plan on first, removing the feed line from the main and testing the pump's output. I found one of Ron's earlier advisories that stated each key hit should produce 10 psi of fuel pressure. I don't get that. So, I'll look up in the Haynes book what the spec from the pump output should be and see if it holds. Perhaps with all the other stuff I've ruined that napa pump's check valve.

At this point, I don't have much else to go on. The FPR has been replaced. About seven years ago, the tank pumps (I have two tanks) were replaced.

That's the short and sweet. Any suggestions are certainly appreciated. I want to get this running myself, as the engine requires a break-in plan of running it with high-zinc oil at 1800 RPM for 20-30 minutes. I just don't trust these Reno mechanics to be on the ball. Sketchy service in this town.

tony

 

Putting this out there: my next step.

Seems that when I first attempted to fire up the new long block, that it didn't hit and I was checking out various things. Then it started to hit, and I'm wondering if that's because the fuel took a while to get into the rails.

As I have two tanks, each one with a low pressure pump, I have to consider that they have failed. This truck had the main rail pump replaced a few times, and those inline pumps replaced some years back. But they neglected to look at the fuel pump relay, and I discovered that connector was very corroded. I replaced the main fuel pump myself about two years ago. Before that, I'd replaced it six months prior. That had started my fuel pump journey back then. I believe that this may have overworked those pumps.

I understand that they are low pressure. However, going back to my issue of a few weeks back, that the truck a few days after cranking... and it shows life as a vehicle that wants to start, but isn't getting gas, I hope to get some feedback and a few tips on this removing tank job. I am working by myself. Is that practical? Should I just get it towed, feed my opinion to the shop and ask them to do the break in?

Thanks in advance! It would be great if I could get her going soon. We need this vehicle for our pet sitting business.

Tony

 

On 1997 and older Rangers Ford used a Return Fuel system, so cycling the key on and off a few times should get fuel up to the rail and injectors
With a rebuilt or new fuel rail air can escape via the Fuel Pressure Regulators valve when fuel pump comes on

1998 and up, Returnless system, would be dry until engine was cranked a few times, so injectors would be opening and letting out the air and allowing fuel in
But shouldn't take more than 4 or 5 cranks of 5 seconds each to get fuel to injectors in either system, assuming key off between cranks

 

Thanks Ron. I'll be checking again for gas in the manifold valley in the center near the Schrader valve. I've had stuff off and on for rechecking that I've lost track if gas has leaked into the area. Any chance that stopping up the FPR outlet would blow gas past new O-rings?

And, I believe the psi specs for the in-tank pumps are around 8 psi... will be looking at that. First look this morning is the dual fuel tank selector switch.

thanks

tony