E-Fan vs truck temp? - Page 6 - Ranger-Forums - The Ultimate Ford Ranger Resource


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  #126  
Old 06-26-2007
D.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeda
Brilliant!! And what is powering the motor driving the pump?????
A 12vdc source. Moroso used to make these ( a while back ) . I used one in my 84 I put a SBF into.
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  #127  
Old 06-26-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D.
A 12vdc source. Moroso used to make these ( a while back ) . I used one in my 84 I put a SBF into.
only thing is i need to fab up a custom bracket for it.......

how did you like it on your SBF D.? did it do a good job? Moroso is the brand i was looking at getting...i wonder if the ribbed pulley would fit on the Ranger's water pump inplace of the stock pulley?
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  #128  
Old 06-26-2007
D.
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Originally Posted by Takeda
Have you heard the phrase "Some people never grow up"?
Yes, as a matter of fact, this reply is to one of those individuals. I take pride in knowing such as its a direct reflection of ' spirit ' as well.

Quote:
For your information, I don't own any "race cars"!
Too bad. If you did, and one broke, you might actually experience something to aid you in your ' quest for the truth ' so to say.

Heres a lesson in Physics for the ' Nay Sayers '. Grab your chair Mr. Ayers, and a box of kleenex as well to dry your tears.

The reason it took 2-3 hours for this reply folks.. I just decided to grab a bottle of laughing gas and BEAT this engine. I was on its way out ( physically ) till I had to make a road trip to Syracuse. I don;t care if it goes ' boom ' as theres a nice shiny one thats a lil bigger in the garage on a stand thats itching to go in here.

Parking brake on, sitting in the driveway after a good hour and a halfs running up and down Fhurman Blvd. Its 86degrees and a humidity/Percipitation level of 50%. 30.19 bar pressure, dewpoint of 65degrees F. Visability of 7 miles. http://www.weather.com/weather/local/USNY0181 . OHC reads 85degrees.. I won't argue with it.

( Being thurough, this is a scientific experiment of sorts. All things are a consideration. )

Sitting time, 5 minutes ( roughly, had to grab the camera and find a flashcard for it.. )



Not even hitting 150 degrees. I even have a higher Idle then most due to Cam profile and the Fuel I use ( Ethanol ) .



Top view of the Adapter Bri made for the hose. Theres a grounding lug and a Sensor/Thermometer boss on it.

Basic Shroud/Factory piece.. one hole drilled for electrical supply..



Relay/Controller for the fan. Couldn't really get to it as theres a fat piece of 0/1 gauge in the way from the Altenator.. Its mounted AWAY from the engine bay itself. Heat is the biggest killer ( outside of electro/statically charged dust ) of electrical components.



Better view of the adaptor.



The adaptor has some road grime as its contact points have been covered in Teflon paste/dialectric grease. I need to clean it off as I'm going to re-use this adapter on the new mill. Didn't feel like pulling it out only to have to pull it again soon. Off the sensor on that adaptor is what the temp gauge on the pillar reads. We all know what our thgermostats are rated at and have a good idea at what temps they should open. What we DONT know is ' how much cooling is occuring in the radiator? '. By watching that Gauge, I know if the e-fan is working or even being efficient.

The BEST temps I could muster with a mechanical fan ( I found my index/log books ) was roughly 180degrees. It was recorded Aug 5th, 2005. ( yep, I dug out the records I used to keep just looking for info. Also found the 9.115 timeslip I had from Lancaster :) )


One Nitrous, Bored and Extruded-headded SOHC. For sale soon!



Anything else Mr. Ayers? I normally respect my elders but I find myself in the ' middle ' on this one ' age ' wise. My Credentials? I'm the biggest Jerk/****/**** on this site ( Ask anyone as Ive had the pleasure of locking horns with all of them, including the site admins ). The individual you were originally stepping on ( Maurice ) is one of the reasons why I was banned before, But in this senario.. ' Right is Right ' and your totally wrong.

I've never offered any ' help or advice ' on Nitrous as I don;t want the liability of hearing of some ' youngster ' ( your term ) wasting a perfectly good engine, but on this topic, I believe the example represents itself.

Your wrong.

A gentleman whom I have the utmost respect for ( even thought he and I will probably never speak again ) named John Griggs Runs an E-Fan. He also runs his truck through things a normal 2wd vehical couldn't. I ask of you, why would a man whom has pioneered a lot of the mods we all use on a daily basis run such a detremental thing? You see my engine bay, have an ' alledged race car ' time for an 8th mile.. Read my profile mate, then ask yourself ' Gee, why would a guy whom has put so much into an engine run an e-fan on a daily driver that he beats on? '. Need anyone Mention Nickster-SVT whom has UNQUESTIONED the most tricked out SOHC of anyone on this site? Cams, Heads, a blower, a wiring system thats.. words cannot describe the time and money hes invested under his hood alone, not to speak of the rest of his truck.. Yet he has an electrical fan.. on a Truck with a Blower?

The answer is simple. The energy saved from the parasitic loss helps with power to the wheels, better MPG readings and honsetly, its more efficient then a mechanical fan. Keeping the engine cooler gives it a longer life.

I understand you might care about the youngsters wallets, but I've learned sometimes these ' youngsters ' MIGHT have a valid point. As ' Few and far in between ' as they are, they still do happen.

Last edited by D.; 06-26-2007 at 12:04 PM.
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  #129  
Old 06-26-2007
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looks good D.!!!

we may but heads on social issues, but when it comes to mechanical issues, i totally agree with and respect your opinions because you have more than likely tried them....

how did you get your stock shroud around the efan with the shroud on it? and how did you mount the efan inside your shroud
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  #130  
Old 06-26-2007
D.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lifted97ranger
looks good D.!!!
Thank you.

Quote:
we may but heads on social issues,
Oh yeah!

Quote:
but when it comes to mechanical issues, i totally agree with and respect your opinions because you have more than likely tried them..
I'm NOT afraid to mention this is the 6th SOHC engine ( I thought it was only 5, but after looking at my ' records '.. ). I've learned by my wallet on many occasions.. and by walking home, calling a wrecker.. Rolling over..

There are things I have NO CLUE about. Lifts? Offroad tires? RCD/Superlifter/itsitshigher parts.. I've helped a couple folks fabricating leafs, and ShadyLuke with his Body lift.. ( I doubt anyone can find a single post of mine in any offroad section outside of how I think something looks. I know nothing of function on half of it.. especially that SAS stuff! ) But outside of that.. I have no fear of saying ' I dont know lifts at all '. Dropping that shyt however, with Tbars.. I have a small clue . Engines/Trannies/Axles.. I'm .. Lets say I've pulled so many I can swap a 4.0sohc for the same inside of 3 hrs and have done it on 2 occasions.

Efans.. I know they work and work well *IF* they are setup properly so they can FUNCTION as directed ( note: I didn't say as ' needed ' as everyones ' needs ' are different ).

Quote:
how did you get your stock shroud around the efan with the shroud on it? and how did you mount the efan inside your shroud
I *believe* thats a stock shroud. It MIGHT be from an Exploder. I know its not original or at best the 3rd replacement

I did have a fan fail. It sorta ate one of those cement barriers while I was ' out having fun ' and .. F-it, You all know what I do.. I was ' rubbed ' and caught a barrier, had to re-do the front end ( thats where the xlt fenders and front clip came from ) . While the whole front end was off and the engine was out, I mounted the fan and shroud and put them in together as ' one piece '. Theres PLEANTY of room to do it even with the engine in the bay, but I was lazy and all the parts were already out.. Why not make life simple?

I also cut rubber strips from an old Bicycle tube and made a ' gasket ' of sorts so the shroud would seal to the radiator. The BIGGEST issue with people having efan trouble.. the air isnt ' directed ' properly ( Ive seen people with other cars wire them wrong so the fan is trying to push instead of pull! ).

Its like with computers.. STKB ( seat to keyboard ) issues happen. We ALL make mistakes. I just wish some of mine were cheaper on the wallet.. Actually, nothing in nteh wallet can beat the knowledge gained, so I can honestly state, it WAS worth it in the learning experience.

If we look at the common mods being done Like OHC's and such, and we look at those ' Pioneers '.. Like Rwenzinger, Griggs, OldFart and some of the ' legends '.. there was a specific ' Attention to detail ' they all paid when doing their mods.. THAT is what will make something work, or fail. If we take the time and do something right, we usually don't have problems later. It was a Hard/Expensive lesson, But it finally made it through my thick skull to NOT take shortcuts.

Its all ' good ' to quote a younger generation
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  #131  
Old 06-26-2007
D.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lifted97ranger
only thing is i need to fab up a custom bracket for it.......

how did you like it on your SBF D.? did it do a good job? Moroso is the brand i was looking at getting...i wonder if the ribbed pulley would fit on the Ranger's water pump inplace of the stock pulley?

I used the Moroso with a .. ( damn.. using my brain too much today.. ).. It was originally a 351 Windsor. It came with a ' universal ' type bracket. The motor was black and had a hole cut in it for inspecting the windings on nthew motor itself. It WAS a toothed belt and had a Plastic ribbed/toothed pully that used 4 bolts on the water pump nose.

You have an OHV. Doing such on a SOHC would be VERY DIFFICULT as teh waterpump is burried under the thermostat housing and surrounded by Belt driven components.

I'm no guru with the OHV BUT, if you can fins a way to mount that Pulley to the water pump nose/neck ( whatever term ya wish to use ) I cannot see why it wouldn't work. You MIGHT have to fabricate a ' spacer ' to extend that neck and you WILL have to fabricate a bracket to hold the dc motor itself..

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Moros...spagenameZWDVW

http://cgi.ebay.com/MOROSO-ELECTRIC-...QQcmdZViewItem

Thats the one I had. It worked VERY well. I DID have a custom 4row radiator that was built for 500cid made for my setup ( and electric fans too! ) to go with it though.

The motor I had had a ' Pot ' with it ( Variable resistor ) to adjust its running speed ( it might have been bought outside of the kit itself and installed by my uncle , I dont remember, was.. shyt.. 1989?90? when they started putting it all together.. I was in the U.K! LOL! ).
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  #132  
Old 06-26-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D.
I used the Moroso with a .. ( damn.. using my brain too much today.. ).. It was originally a 351 Windsor. It came with a ' universal ' type bracket. The motor was black and had a hole cut in it for inspecting the windings on nthew motor itself. It WAS a toothed belt and had a Plastic ribbed/toothed pully that used 4 bolts on the water pump nose.

You have an OHV. Doing such on a SOHC would be VERY DIFFICULT as teh waterpump is burried under the thermostat housing and surrounded by Belt driven components.

I'm no guru with the OHV BUT, if you can fins a way to mount that Pulley to the water pump nose/neck ( whatever term ya wish to use ) I cannot see why it wouldn't work. You MIGHT have to fabricate a ' spacer ' to extend that neck and you WILL have to fabricate a bracket to hold the dc motor itself..

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Moros...spagenameZWDVW

http://cgi.ebay.com/MOROSO-ELECTRIC-...QQcmdZViewItem

Thats the one I had. It worked VERY well. I DID have a custom 4row radiator that was built for 500cid made for my setup ( and electric fans too! ) to go with it though.

The motor I had had a ' Pot ' with it ( Variable resistor ) to adjust its running speed ( it might have been bought outside of the kit itself and installed by my uncle , I dont remember, was.. shyt.. 1989?90? when they started putting it all together.. I was in the U.K! LOL! ).
sweet! if i can't figure out how to make a bracket to hold the DC motor above the engine, i am sure i can find a way to have the rear of the DC motor out by the radiator....i have almost 4-5" of clearance between the radiator and the farthest out part of my OHV.....a spacer probably wouldn't be too much trouble......take the old pulley and use it as a template!

the main reason i am doing this is to have something different, and THEN so i can have 1 less restriction on my engine......every little bit helps
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  #133  
Old 06-26-2007
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i wish someone made an electric water pump like this for a Ranger.... http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/CSR-B...QQcmdZViewItem
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  #134  
Old 06-26-2007
D.
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Some food for thought.. I don't know if it will stress teh berring in the pump though..

The plastic pully that comes with the kit.. If you were to cut a dew-can in half.. they would be shaped the same. Innstead of mounting the pully so it covers the neck of the pump.. it you mounted it backwards and used the pilot to stabalise it.. it would ( theorhetically ) extend the neck of the pump 2-2.5 inches.. It might even clear the serp. belt thats presently there and line up with a self-fabbed bracket to the DC motor if you were to turn it backwards ( They make brackets for Serp. driven blowers that do this now.. I cant see why the same couldn't be applied for a water pump motor mount. ).

If its a toothed belt, there wont be a lot of pressure needed in keeping the belt tight so stress on the pump berring might actually be LESS then the original Serp belt with its tensioner force. It WILL free up some parasitic loss for sure.. how much.. I dunno.. But its a lot less reciprocating mass/energy being taken away from the accessory setup. The only thing taking more is the A/C condensor.
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  #135  
Old 06-26-2007
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You can get an inline electric water pump. you cut the upper radiator hose and splice it in between. I don't know it's durability on a daily driver though. I see them on 7 sec FWD race cars at Nopi events.
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  #136  
Old 06-26-2007
D.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lifted97ranger
i wish someone made an electric water pump like this for a Ranger.... http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/CSR-B...QQcmdZViewItem
I have a blue one on my new mill :)
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  #137  
Old 06-26-2007
D.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by graniteguy
You can get an inline electric water pump. you cut the upper radiator hose and splice it in between. I don't know it's durability on a daily driver though. I see them on 7 sec FWD race cars at Nopi events.
In doing such, you would have to find a way to make a ' bypass ' for where the factory pump is. It wouldn't be a ' common ' thing for the average person as it would require metal/sheet work or some bucks and a seriously talented cnc op. :)
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  #138  
Old 06-26-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by graniteguy
zach. Here is the fan:

http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku

trust me on it.

.

dang forgot I asked for you to post yours. I ordered another one earlier this morning. I will try it and see if it works well. Lets hope.

Side note though I book marked that one.
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  #139  
Old 06-26-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D.
I have a blue one on my new mill :)
yea but your new engine isn't a 4.0 either...........or is it? if it is a 4.0, then were did you find the electric water pump to fit it?
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  #140  
Old 06-26-2007
D.
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Zach.. That fan is LOUD :) . Physically, it hauls a lot of air, but it makes a lot of fan-noise when it cuts the air.
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  #141  
Old 06-26-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D.
Zach.. That fan is LOUD :) . Physically, it hauls a lot of air, but it makes a lot of fan-noise when it cuts the air.

which one the one Wayne posted or the one I bought?

Here is the one I bought
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku

And the one Wayne posted.
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku

only problem with the one Wayne posted is I would still have to figure out the shroud thing.
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  #142  
Old 06-26-2007
D.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lifted97ranger
yea but your new engine isn't a 4.0 either...........or is it? if it is a 4.0, then were did you find the electric water pump to fit it?
Its not a 4.0. The 4.0 SOHC can only go so far then it runs out of ' Displacement ' ( Old school physics that cannot change :) ). They won't allow an ' Atomic ' powersource in NewYork under my hood.. so.. I added a few Cylinders. Should be cheaper in the long run but I'll have to waste time fueling.. Instead of being able to run for 12 years, it will run for like.. 12 minnutes then need re-fueling :D
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  #143  
Old 06-26-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D.

The reason it took 2-3 hours for this reply folks.. I just decided to grab a bottle of laughing gas and BEAT this engine. I was on its way out ( physically ) till I had to make a road trip to Syracuse. I don;t care if it goes ' boom ' as theres a nice shiny one thats a lil bigger in the garage on a stand thats itching to go in here.

Parking brake on, sitting in the driveway after a good hour and a halfs running up and down Fhurman Blvd. Its 86degrees and a humidity/Percipitation level of 50%. 30.19 bar pressure, dewpoint of 65degrees F. Visability of 7 miles. http://www.weather.com/weather/local/USNY0181 . OHC reads 85degrees.. I won't argue with it.

( Being thurough, this is a scientific experiment of sorts. All things are a consideration. )

Sitting time, 5 minutes ( roughly, had to grab the camera and find a flashcard for it.. )



Not even hitting 150 degrees. I even have a higher Idle then most due to Cam profile and the Fuel I use ( Ethanol ) .

wow, I hope I can keep mine that cool after the new fan and a Tstat.

How is your fan set to come on? Surely you see the outbound temp rise to some degree then the fan kicks on and it drops to some temp. What is that range that the fan would run? say just sitting at idle because otherwise there are too many variables.
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  #144  
Old 06-26-2007
D.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zabeard
which one the one Wayne posted or the one I bought?

Here is the one I bought
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku

And the one Wayne posted.
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku

only problem with the one Wayne posted is I would still have to figure out the shroud thing.

The one you bought.. Its an ' S ' blade and will run a LOT quieter. It will STILL need a Shroud to work effectivly. Griggs has a straight bladed fan and it sounds like an air-raid siren going off.

Picture the fan as a .. a ' pump ', the shroud helps the pulling of air It basically channels the flow. In nascar they call it a backdraft or ( something ) where one car rides teh **** of the other so it takes less energy to keep the momentum going.. teh same applies with a shroud.. It makes that airflow more efficient, it flows better.
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  #145  
Old 06-26-2007
D.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zabeard
wow, I hope I can keep mine that cool after the new fan and a Tstat.
Our trucks are VERY simular. I can't see why it wouldn't stay that cool for ya.

Quote:
How is your fan set to come on? Surely you see the outbound temp rise to some degree then the fan kicks on and it drops to some temp.
The fan controler has one of those ' pins ' going into the Radiator. The controler is set to 160 degrees ( whatever its lowest setting is ) . Theres also a connection to the A/C relay and Dash Fan/blower motor. Whenever the HVAC is turned on, the E-Fan will also come on. A/C on? Yep, E-fan kicks right on. Usually, when I first head out in the early morning ( its about 70ish Farenheight presently ) I'll make it onto Route5 by teh waterfront and open it up.. The Tstat opens, the gauge shows ( roughly ) 180ish.. then you can literally watch the needle drop as the fan and wind hits the radiator.

Maybe I can get FMD to come over as his camera makes Movies. I dunno if he would want to ride with me after the last time with that Beemer :) . Then again, dinner at the Casino is a good persuasion :D . Oh Dave? Where ya at?

Quote:
What is that range that the fan would run? say just sitting at idle because otherwise there are too many variables.
If I'm at idle, the engine is warmed.. Basically, when the regular dash gauge is in operating range, the fan comes on and stays on till the temp drops below whats on the operating range on the dash. When I'm crusing down a freeway/Thruway.. That temp gauge drops to 0 ( indicator goes below its lowest reading ) and the E-fan kicks off ( Endless the A/C is on.. then its sorta ' hard wired ' on by the A/C switch ). Some of that ' low ' reading is due to wind hitting the sensors rear element thats in the adaptor. It causes unmeasured cooling, thus why I wanted to do a ' standing still ' reading. A 12mph wind from normal weather is different then the vehical doing 130ish down the road.

Theres a wire tapped into near the intake manifold . A ' legend ' named RayJay hooked it in for me on my way to Centrallia back in 05 sometime I'll snag some pics and draw up a wiring diagram if you would like? Wouldn't take long..

Last edited by D.; 06-26-2007 at 01:29 PM.
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  #146  
Old 06-26-2007
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Damn D. all you do is hit people with knowledge...LOL

So the consensus is that the E-fan is worth the money and it is better then the stock mechanical fan?
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  #147  
Old 06-26-2007
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Ok so if I went an Efan what one would be best? Im sort of worried bout the tranny temps you guys are posting. I figure money wouldnt be an issue I can save and wait a few months to buy.

Takeda - STFU man! I really didnt post so I can see what its like when a person has their head up their *** and tries to post a comment.
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  #148  
Old 06-26-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IR0NS1N
Ok so if I went an Efan what one would be best? Im sort of worried bout the tranny temps you guys are posting. I figure money wouldnt be an issue I can save and wait a few months to buy.

Takeda - STFU man! I really didnt post so I can see what its like when a person has their head up their *** and tries to post a comment.
i would say any of these 2 would be your best route:
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku

just REMEMBER to use your stock fan shroud in conjunction with the efan......that doesn't mean put the fan right on the radiator and then the shroud around it, put the efan in the smaller opening that goes around your mechanical fan and then attach it to the radiator...
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  #149  
Old 06-26-2007
D.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Of War
Damn D. all you do is hit people with knowledge...LOL
I'm FAR from the ' All knowing ' . I know a lot about some things, then NOTHING AT ALL on others. Besides, what good are ' experiences ' ( good and bad ) if we don't pass them along?

Quote:
So the consensus is that the E-fan is worth the money and it is better then the stock mechanical fan?
It depends.

I will be 100% and non-biased. If your using a vehical for CONSTANT work, using a truck as nothing but a ' Truck ' ( IE: your bed always has something in it ) , I would NOT use an E-Fan myself ***IF*** it had an Automatic Tranny.

I WOULD use an E-Fan with some form of a ' Tranny cooler ' on an automatic tranny. Honestly, I feel ALL Automatic trannies could use a boost in cooling from what the factory already has in the Radiator.

For a daily driver or ' recreational ' vehical, Sure, not a problem, Efan all the way unquestioned.

Last edited by D.; 06-26-2007 at 02:52 PM.
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  #150  
Old 06-26-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D.
I WOULD use an E-Fan with some form of a ' Tranny cooler ' on an automatic tranny. Honestly, I feel ALL Automatic trannies could use a boost in cooling from what the factory already has in the Radiator.
that is how mine is set up.....aftermarket tranny cooler with the efan......i am thinking about also removing the lines from the radiator and plugging the holes in the radiator and running a second cooler and interlooping them together.....then cutting the cooler lines off back under the cab and running rubber gas line hose to the new coolers...

BTW: how is your tranny's cooling Zach Beard after you did the cooler only?
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